LOW TEST LEVELS OR NO?

[Leaveit]

Hey,


I was planning my first test cycle for next month and just got my bloods done to know where I am at...everything checked by my doc was in normal range including lipids and all ..except my test range fell at 271 ng/dl ?

Component Standard Range Your Value
TESTOSTERONE 189.00 - 726.00 ng/dl 271.00


My doctor is trying to tell me this is normal range? But for 28 y/o? You guys are talking about 400's over here lol ...isnt 271 bad? then why the hell is he saying normal!

Why is the range so low starting at 189.00-726 what is range for people that start trt?

 

[mustang89]

Hey, I was planning my first test cycle for next month and just got my bloods done to know where I am at...everything checked by my doc was in normal range including lipids and all ..except my test range fell at 271 ng/dl ? Component Standard Range Your Value TESTOSTERONE 189.00 - 726.00 ng/dl 271.00 My doctor is trying to tell me this is normal range? But for 28 y/o? You guys are talking about 400's over here lol ...isnt 271 bad? then why the hell is he saying normal! Why is the range so low starting at 189.00-726 what is range for people that start trt?

That seems pretty low to me but I ain't a doctor lol

 

[Leaveit]

LOL , I don't think you need to be a doctor to read the results... low is low. high is high...it's pretty simple to me

 

[damage007]

Hey,


I was planning my first test cycle for next month and just got my bloods done to know where I am at...everything checked by my doc was in normal range including lipids and all ..except my test range fell at 271 ng/dl ?

Component Standard Range Your Value
TESTOSTERONE 189.00 - 726.00 ng/dl 271.00


My doctor is trying to tell me this is normal range? But for 28 y/o? You guys are talking about 400's over here lol ...isnt 271 bad? then why the hell is he saying normal!

Why is the range so low starting at 189.00-726 what is range for people that start trt?

That's pretty low for your age, if testosterone is low, nitric oxide will be low. That's part* of why Low T levels are associated with heart disease and blood pressure issues.

 

[kenpoengineer]

You indicate, in your first post, that you are planning to run your first test cycle, does this imply you were using oral PH or AAS in the past? If so then you are still shut down from your past cycles. If not, and you are natural, then your test level is very low for your age.

 

[kisaj]

Remember, doctors that don't understand hormones will only work off of lab results and to them, this is normal because it falls into range. They don't take into account that the lab ranges include men in their 40s, 50s, 60s, and 70s in most cases. So a 70 year old man could come in and get a 271 ng/dl reading and also be told he is in normal range. What matters is if this is normal for you. Do you have any symptoms you are experiencing? Typically, a single TT lab doesn't tell you much and it can change day to day and even drop up to 30-40% throughout the day.

Lots of variables in play, but the short story is that on that scale, 271 is low normal regardless of how old you are.

 

[Leaveit]

Hi,


I took the blood work at 10am , right after a good night rest and fasting . Yes I have ran 2 ph cycles in the past , never went higher than 6 weeks.. Andromass and then dienazone , I recovered fine . One was over 2 years ago and my last one was in September . I ran proper pct protocols . When I was in pct and after libido was sky high and I kept most mass gains with some strength lost . Pct was finalized 3 months ago... Some symptoms I usually have is fatigue , and lack of sex drive . I can still maintain erection though. I do find it hard to lose weight on mod section if I cut .

 

[kisaj]

Did you get blood work after the cycles to confirm you came back? In any case it is low and if you are concerned, you should get full labs to determine why. Another cycle is only going to hurt you more, so better to find out now.

 

[lboston]

Did you have free T and estradiol tested?

 

[Leaveit]

I did not get blood work done, my insurance lapsed and I was waiting for new insurance (which I just got this month) . I pay up the ass for my health insurance but since I moved to texas , they made me re apply and i lost coverage for a couple months. I told him I wanted to get tested for low T and my doctor acted shocked ? I told him I wanted to be tested for everything.. looks like he didn't order everything. I am wondering if I had a pre-existing condition which could have been made worst... i don't have any regrets but would like to get this taken care of if it needs to be.... I should get re tested ... this is everything he tested....


Component Standard Range Your Value
TSH 0.35 - 4.00 uIU/mL 1.59

VITAMIN D, 25 OH 30.0 - 100.0 ng/ml 31.0


CHOLESTEROL 140 - 200 mg/dl 136
TRIGLYCERIDES 35 - 150 mg/dl 85
HDL CHOLESTEROL >40 mg/dl 59
CALCULATED LDL CHOL 80 - 130 mg/dl 60
CHD 0.00 - 4.44 ratio 2.31



Sodium 135 - 145 mm/L 138
POTASSIUM 3.5 - 5.1 mm/L 4.4
CHLORIDE 96 - 109 MM/L 103
ECO2 23 - 33 mm/L 32
GLUCOSE 70 - 100 mg/dl 97
Nonfasting Range: 70-130 mg/dl
BUN 7 - 22 mg/dl 18
Creatinine, Ser 0.50 - 1.40 mg/dl 0.99
eGFR NON-AFRICAN AMER. >60.00 mL/min/1.73m^2 >60
eGFR AFRICAN AMER. >60.00 mL/min/1.73m^2 >60
Ca 8.4 - 10.2 mg/dl 9.3
BILIRUBIN, TOTAL 0.0 - 1.2 mg/dl 1.1
SGPT (ALT) 15 - 78 U/L 42
SGOT (AST) 9 - 44 U/L 14
ALKALINE PHOSPHATASE 40 - 136 U/L 68
PROTEIN, TOTAL 6.7 - 8.8 g/dl 7.9
ALBUMIN 3.1 - 4.5 g/dl 4.5
CALCULATED GLOBULIN 3.1 - 5.0 g/dl 3.4
CALCULATED A/G RATIO 0.7 - 1.4 ratio 1.3
Anion Gap 5 - 15 mmol/L 3
B/C ratio 10.0 - 20.0 ratio 18.2

 

[kisaj]

Well, your vit D and cholesterol is low and that is directly related to your hormone levels. You need to address that.

 

[Leaveit]

My Multi V i take every day has 1500 IU of vitamin D in it. I also eat healthy, take salmon fish oil every day. I don't eat fried food.. eat clean... don't drink soda or anything sugary... I don't drink a lot and if I do I mix with perrier with no sugar.? What would be reasons for low cholesterol?

 

[kisaj]

That is something to discuss with your doc. It is usually surrounding diet and how the body responds to it. My wife had low cholesterol and it was the source of several issues she was having. She was told to cut back on grains and up her fat intake and that helped a lot to bring her in normal range. BTW- cholesterol is involved with the production of vitamin D, so that would also explain why supplementing with it is not doing you much good.

 

[Jiigzz]

My Multi V i take every day has 1500 IU of vitamin D in it. I also eat healthy, take salmon fish oil every day. I don't eat fried food.. eat clean... don't drink soda or anything sugary... I don't drink a lot and if I do I mix with perrier with no sugar.? What would be reasons for low cholesterol?

Take vitamin d3 as well. Take a look at your total daily fat intake - the stupid media has everyone thinking eating fat (particularly saturated) will promote heart disease and so they restrict it severly. This will impact steroidal hormones like Testosterone if the fat values are too low.

There are some correlational studies investigating cholesterol values between 200-210 are optimal for lowering all cause mortality based on worldwide data yet many docs will try lower it if you get near 200. Correlational studies only though.

Bear in mind also there is a huge body of evidence showing that higher fat lower carb diets promote better lipid values over higher carb lower fat.

 

[Leaveit]

Take vitamin d3 as well. Take a look at your total daily fat intake - the stupid media has everyone thinking eating fat (particularly saturated) will promote heart disease and so they restrict it severly. This will impact steroidal hormones like Testosterone if the fat values are too low.

There are some correlational studies investigating cholesterol values between 200-210 are optimal for lowering all cause mortality based on worldwide data yet many docs will try lower it if you get near 200. Correlational studies only though.

Bear in mind also there is a huge body of evidence showing that higher fat lower carb diets promote better lipid values over higher carb lower fat.

I picked up some vitmamin d3, i tend to get a good amount of beef and healthy fats in my diet every week (including nuts , almonds, almond butter and coconut butter) . I guess I will try to get this cholesterol up also, I will be getting retested in about 2-3 weeks do see if the vitamin d helps effect my test levels....

Ive been reading anything under 300 is considered hypogonadal , and although I hope its just my cholesterol and vitamin d affecting my levels. I also told him I want to be tested for testosterone, FSH, LH, Estradiol and Prolactin. To confirm anything. If I do have hypogonadal , I would like to address it accordingly. Ill update when my next bloods come in.

 

[sammpedd88]

I picked up some vitmamin d3, i tend to get a good amount of beef and healthy fats in my diet every week (including nuts , almonds, almond butter and coconut butter) . I guess I will try to get this cholesterol up also, I will be getting retested in about 2-3 weeks do see if the vitamin d helps effect my test levels.... Ive been reading anything under 300 is considered hypogonadal , and although I hope its just my cholesterol and vitamin d affecting my levels. I also told him I want to be tested for testosterone, FSH, LH, Estradiol and Prolactin. To confirm anything. If I do have hypogonadal , I would like to address it accordingly. Ill update when my next bloods come in.

Take 5000 iu's of D3 a day. It help help dramatically. That's what my dr has me on.

 

[Leaveit]

I am starting the d3 today. did you notice a change in your test levels after starting d3 supplementation?

 

[sammpedd88]

I am starting the d3 today. did you notice a change in your test levels after starting d3 supplementation?

Yes a slight increase in my free T but I don't know if it was the D3 or a combination of things I'm taking such as pregnenolone and DHEA.

 

[Leaveit]

oh,

so you can't be fore sure? I hope it helps me. Its not fun having low t.... DHEA helps too but i think it can be suppressive itself if used too long?

 

[sammpedd88]

oh, so you can't be fore sure? I hope it helps me. Its not fun having low t.... DHEA helps too but i think it can be suppressive itself if used too long?

As far as the DHEA, it's not going to suppress your T levels. I take DHEA, pregnenolone and vitamin D3 everyday. The amount I take depends on what my blood levels are and what my dr tells me to take.

 

[damage007]

As far as the DHEA, it's not going to suppress your T levels. I take DHEA, pregnenolone and vitamin D3 everyday. The amount I take depends on what my blood levels are and what my dr tells me to take.

DHEA / Pregnenolone are positive modulators of NMDA-glutamate receptors; that means they can actually help support gonadotropin/testosterone production indirectly, providing E2 is in balance etc

 

[ucheoma]

Do you need an AI with DHEA? I've read so much conflicting info about DHEA that I have decided to stand on the side-lines. I'm hypergonadal and have low T so I'm looking for elements to bump m free and total test as well as sperm production.

Can DHEA help in this regard or are there better alternatives? (not yet considering TRT as don't want anything that could further lower my sperm production)

DHEA / Pregnenolone are positive modulators of NMDA-glutamate receptors; that means they can actually help support gonadotropin/testosterone production indirectly, providing E2 is in balance etc

 

[kisaj]

No you don't. There is no benefit to increasing DHEA levels beyond physiological levels and the majority of people will have no estrogen sides when staying in this range. I understand most people don't run labs, but you'll know pretty fast if this is increasing by acne and oily skin which is one of the main sides. Just back down the dose. Also, I'd recommend going with transdermal or sublingual over oral. Oral does work well despite what you may read, but it also tends to convert to estrogen more than the other delivery methods.

Pregnenolone and DHEA are part of my TRT protocol, just FYI.

 

[ucheoma]

Thanks. So is this a good protocol to follow for low test/sperm production or are there better alternatives? Not sure if you're saying DHEA is best where you have DHEA deficiency rather than for the mechanism of t boosting?

No you don't. There is no benefit to increasing DHEA levels beyond physiological levels and the majority of people will have no estrogen sides when staying in this range. I understand most people don't run labs, but you'll know pretty fast if this is increasing by acne and oily skin which is one of the main sides. Just back down the dose. Also, I'd recommend going with transdermal or sublingual over oral. Oral does work well despite what you may read, but it also tends to convert to estrogen more than the other delivery methods.

Pregnenolone and DHEA are part of my TRT protocol, just FYI.

 

[kisaj]

DHEA is not for test boosting and is, quite honestly, a very poor supplement for that purpose. Very little is actually converted into testosterone. However, if you are deficient or even just at the mid range, moving to the top of the range can have dramatic effects on energy and mood. Stacking with pregnenolone increases this and also is amazing for memory and anxiety.

 

[ucheoma]

Thanks. That's what I thought. What symptoms might you look for of DHEA deficiency? I might request a test for DHEA when I do my next bloodwork on the NHS.

DHEA is not for test boosting and is, quite honestly, a very poor supplement for that purpose. Very little is actually converted into testosterone. However, if you are deficient or even just at the mid range, moving to the top of the range can have dramatic effects on energy and mood. Stacking with pregnenolone increases this and also is amazing for memory and anxiety.

 

[kisaj]

The symptoms would be subtle because they would happen over a long period of time. You could go one of two routes- try supplementing and see how you feel, or get labs. Generally if it is not needed, you won't feel much and may begin to see the estrogen sides fairly fast.

 

[damage007]

No you don't. There is no benefit to increasing DHEA levels beyond physiological levels and the majority of people will have no estrogen sides when staying in this range. I understand most people don't run labs, but you'll know pretty fast if this is increasing by acne and oily skin which is one of the main sides. Just back down the dose. Also, I'd recommend going with transdermal or sublingual over oral. Oral does work well despite what you may read, but it also tends to convert to estrogen more than the other delivery methods.

Pregnenolone and DHEA are part of my TRT protocol, just FYI.

You're a smart man, DHEA/Pregnenolone should be supplemented while on TRT; they have their own unique pathway independent of interactions with estrogen receptors or androgen receptors.

That's the problem with so many folks on TRT; they forget or haven't researched that preg/DHEA are also essential and probably shut down (under normal circumstances) whilst on TRT.

 

[kisaj]

I preach it almost annoyingly so because the difference it can make can literally change a person's life.

 

[B5150]

I recovered fine .

I did not get blood work done,

How many times has this been said? Far too many. Yet low (pun intended) and behold - here we are.

Good luck.

 

[lboston]

I preach it almost annoyingly so because the difference it can make can literally change a person's life.

how do you typically dose them? Care to share?

 

[sammpedd88]

how do you typically dose them? Care to share?

I take 25 mgs of DHEA 5 days a week and pregnenolone 100mgs every day. I get refar blood work done so I adjust my doses from there.

 

[kisaj]

how do you typically dose them? Care to share?

50mg preg and 25mg DHEA on inject days (2x weekly) now that I am stable. I ran 50/25 daily until I was steady in the upper normal range. Sometimes I like to recreation dose on a weekend hike or something and will take 100mg preg and 150mg phenylpiracetam for a completely blissful, beautiful experience. I know you didn't ask about that but if you were ever wondering about a rec version.

 

[MindWarrior]

Yes that's very low.