HCG Monotherapy

[lboston]

Gents, anyone ever do HCG as a standalone for TRT?
Went to a new doc today that specializes in male fertility. My wife and I are interested in potentially having a third baby and the doctor has advised HCG 1500iu two times per week.

Any experience out there?

 

[sammpedd88]

Gents, anyone ever do HCG as a standalone for TRT? Went to a new doc today that specializes in male fertility. My wife and I are interested in potentially having a third baby and the doctor has advised HCG 1500iu two times per week. Any experience out there?

What is your reasoning for this? Have you had bloodwork done and it shows low T? I assume since you're going to a fertility dr that you have been tested and have a low sperm count? HCG can help with that under certain circumstances. I myself have not and will not take HCG. I have children and don't plan on anymore. Also HCG is known to elevate E2. I have a hard enough time keeping mine under control without HCG.

 

[lboston]

What is your reasoning for this? Have you had bloodwork done and it shows low T? I assume since you're going to a fertility dr that you have been tested and have a low sperm count? HCG can help with that under certain circumstances. I myself have not and will not take HCG. I have children and don't plan on anymore. Also HCG is known to elevate E2. I have a hard enough time keeping mine under control without HCG.

Been on TRT for four years due to low t. This is to get the boys up and running again.

That's my biggest concern is the E2 elevation. This Dr monitors that on every draw he told me , and would prescribe Adex if needed .

I've done clomid before and it worked, so that is an option as well.

 

[sammpedd88]

Been on TRT for four years due to low t. This is to get the boys up and running again. That's my biggest concern is the E2 elevation. This Dr monitors that on every draw he told me , and would prescribe Adex if needed . I've done clomid before and it worked, so that is an option as well.

In that case I would say HCG would be good especially if you're being tested for your E2.

 

[Gutterpump]

Gents, anyone ever do HCG as a standalone for TRT?
Went to a new doc today that specializes in male fertility. My wife and I are interested in potentially having a third baby and the doctor has advised HCG 1500iu two times per week.

Any experience out there?

If you're trying to have kids, HCG monotherapy is a great option. But what will REALLY make a big difference in sperm quality, is the addition of HMG.

HCG is to LH
as
HMG is to FSH

You truly need both, it's your best bet. Keep in mind, if you are primary hypogonadic (damaged testes), then monotherapy will not work as well.

edit: as lboston mentioned, Clomid therapy is a good option too (if you are secondary). The strongest method would be the combo of hCG/hMG though

 

[lboston]

If you're trying to have kids, HCG monotherapy is a great option. But what will REALLY make a big difference in sperm quality, is the addition of HMG. HCG is to LH as HMG is to FSH You truly need both, it's your best bet. Keep in mind, if you are primary hypogonadic (damaged testes), then monotherapy will not work as well. edit: as lboston mentioned, Clomid therapy is a good option too (if you are secondary). The strongest method would be the combo of hCG/hMG though

Thanks for the feedback. I'm secondary. Been on clomid before and got to 800ng/dl on that alone. E2 was slightly high with that, but felt decent .

 

[lboston]

Can one expect any significant fat loss from a rather high weekly biweekly dose of HCG?

 

[Mr.TT]

If you diet.
HCG also mimics TSH, so your metabolism will be running higher.

 

[lboston]

If you diet. HCG also mimics TSH, so your metabolism will be running higher.

The doc wants me to do 1500iu 2x per week if I do the HCG thing....seems like a pretty high dose.

 

[dhickey]

750IU per week would probably work if a SERM worked that good for you. 125IU ED got my free T to the top of the range. Doing 250IU MWF now. Need to retest, but expect similar results. The key is to take only what you need to get the appropriate response. Minimized E2 issues, desensitization if it exists and cost.

I suppose to you could do two large doses to get things going, but I don't see much point in doing that long term. I wasn't concerned with fertility, so maybe that changes things a bit.

 

[lboston]

750IU per week would probably work if a SERM worked that good for you. 125IU ED got my free T to the top of the range. Doing 250IU MWF now. Need to retest, but expect similar results. The key is to take only what you need to get the appropriate response. Minimized E2 issues, desensitization if it exists and cost. I suppose to you could do two large doses to get things going, but I don't see much point in doing that long term. I wasn't concerned with fertility, so maybe that changes things a bit.

I think it must be to get things jump started. The doc did say that he wanted to get my T up quick.

Have you had any blood drawls lately? You take an AI?

 

[dhickey]

I think it must be to get things jump started. The doc did say that he wanted to get my T up quick.

Have you had any blood drawls lately? You take an AI?

No testing since May. 125IU HCG ED, 25mg Aromasin MWF.

Total T = 529 ng/dl (348-1197)
Free T = 22 pg/ml (9-25)
E2 = 27 pg/ml (8-43)

Pretty much the same results I got from 500IU ED. I was taking 6mg Aromasin ED with some Boron and Calcium d-Glucarate around that test. Pretty much the same results as 100mg of Test per week in divided doses.

Free T towards the top the range and E2 at around the same value. Should be close to optimal for health purposes. I have low SHBG, so I don't pay much attention to total T.

 

[hardtoget]

Coming from personal experience, as I take HCG with Clomid due to fertility reasons after being on TRT for a year and left sterile. Thankfully I am back to normal again, however HCG raises Estrogen levels in my body like nobody's business. It's really bad at times, I take Arimidex frequently and the Clomid doesn't seem to really help lower the E2. 1500 IU 2x wk is overkill IMO. Just 1000 IU a week would be fine.

 

[dhickey]

Coming from personal experience, as I take HCG with Clomid due to fertility reasons after being on TRT for a year and left sterile. Thankfully I am back to normal again, however HCG raises Estrogen levels in my body like nobody's business. It's really bad at times, I take Arimidex frequently and the Clomid doesn't seem to really help lower the E2. 1500 IU 2x wk is overkill IMO. Just 1000 IU a week would be fine.

This is point missed by most. You take only enough to get the desired response to minimize E2 issues. If you're only taking enough to mimic healthy LH levels, E2 shouldn't be an issue. 750IU per week is about the same total T as high normal LH from a SERM. Better Free T on HCG and easier to manage E2 when compared to clomid for me.

 

[lboston]

Gents, thanks for all the feedback in the thread. Sorry it has taken me a couple of days to post back. Kids and work have both been crazy.

Unfortunately, my insurance isn't wanting to cover he HCG, so looks like that's not going to be an option. Id self pay, but the pharmacy will only fill the script for what the doc wrote- which would cost me 3-400 per month. So, I'm going to have to go the clomid route. Doc wrote that for 50mg ED, but I think that sounds like a heavy dose....follow up apt is Feb 11 to look at free and total T, as well as E2.

I've done clomid before for a 6 week stint for TRT when we were trying to conceive our second and TT went to 701 ng/dl, free was around 19ng/dl...that doc didn't test E2. Sides made me a little emotional at time, but nothing major. I sent back on shots after my first blood drawl b/c my wife had gotten pregnant.

 

[hardtoget]

You need to have the HCG prescription sent to Talon Compounding pharmacy in Texas. I get my HCG from there 11,000 IU vials go for $71. Can't get that anywhere.

 

[lboston]

You need to have the HCG prescription sent to Talon Compounding pharmacy in Texas. I get my HCG from there 11,000 IU vials go for $71. Can't get that anywhere.

Wow. That's a pretty nice price! According to the script, I'd need 4 vials. May look in to that. Thanks for the tip, mate.

 

[hardtoget]

No worries and 4 vials, ****, sounds a lot like my fertility doctor. 3-4 vials of HCG at 11,000 IU would last me 3-4 months. Remember HCG at high doses won't even be absorbed its not like Test in the bloodstream.

 

[lboston]

No worries and 4 vials, ****, sounds a lot like my fertility doctor. 3-4 vials of HCG at 11,000 IU would last me 3-4 months. Remember HCG at high doses won't even be absorbed its not like Test in the bloodstream.

I know it, man. It's a ton- don't know why he wants so much. Wish I could rationalize that with him. Doesn't look like a possibility though!

Have you ever used clomid? Was that an option?

 

[kisaj]

No worries and 4 vials, ****, sounds a lot like my fertility doctor. 3-4 vials of HCG at 11,000 IU would last me 3-4 months. Remember HCG at high doses won't even be absorbed its not like Test in the bloodstream.

When I was originally put on HCG, the 11,000 IU vile was a huge waste because it is not stable after 30-45 days after adding the bac water. They should be prescribing the smaller 5000 IU viles.

Also, good commenting on the e2 issues that so many people don't realize. It will spike that off the charts and cause horrible sides.

 

[hardtoget]

I might just do the 5,000 IU vials and just get a bunch of them, Didn't know how unstable it is at 11,000 IU's.

 

[kisaj]

It's not the amount that makes it unstable, it's that it doesn't last and loses potency after 30-45 days so if you aren't going nuts on 2500IU a week, then it becomes a waste at the end.

 

[Gutterpump]

When I was originally put on HCG, the 11,000 IU vile was a huge waste because it is not stable after 30-45 days after adding the bac water. They should be prescribing the smaller 5000 IU viles.
.

One option is to preload syringes and freeze them for later use. Should stay stable this way.

HCG is also available from India and fairly cheap to order online (but then it gets into the territory of self-treating, which many aren't comfortable with).

 

[kisaj]

Is that an option? I never tried that, but I would assume that the process of mixing it with the bac water would begin the degradation regardless of freezing or refrigerating. I don't know, so if that worked for you, then that is a great alternative.

 

[Gutterpump]

Is that an option? I never tried that, but I would assume that the process of mixing it with the bac water would begin the degradation regardless of freezing or refrigerating. I don't know, so if that worked for you, then that is a great alternative.

I have never tried it, but I know people who use this method when they have large quantities of HCG. Freezing will stop the degradation process with all protein peptides.

Using too much bac water can cause degradation to occur faster as well. I've read that HCG (and all peptides) will remain stable longer, when using less water, as the peptide fragments will remain closer packed together in solution.

 

[hardtoget]

I have ordered HCG from India before. First shipment got seized, then it was gladly sent again for free. Good quality, seemed like it was overdosed.

 

[lboston]

I have ordered HCG from India before. First shipment got seized, then it was gladly sent again for free. Good quality, seemed like it was overdosed.

Whas this from a chemist that happens to be all day?

 

[hardtoget]

Don't know.

 

[Gutterpump]

Whas this from a chemist that happens to be all day?

Chemists that are all day, everyday, are great.

 

[lboston]

Chemists that are all day, everyday, are great.

never dealt with them all day, but may have to give it a try.

Do they carry ADDERAL? That's what I'm currently in the market for ; ) took one today from a co-worker and had the most productive day of my life!

I've brought this up to my family physician and he says adults can't have ADHD...nice, huh?

I'm the director of a small city's public school special education department...I deal with students with exceptional needs, and their families, and I'm certain I know what I'm talking about when it comes to ADHD.

 

[sammpedd88]

never dealt with them all day, but may have to give it a try. Do they carry ADDERAL? That's what I'm currently in the market for ; ) took one today from a co-worker and had the most productive day of my life! I've brought this up to my family physician and he says adults can't have ADHD...nice, huh? I'm the director of a small city's public school special education department...I deal with students with exceptional needs, and their families, and I'm certain I know what I'm talking about when it comes to ADHD.

That's a crock! My father was diagnosed with ADD when he was 49. Still takes adderall now and he's 64.