29 y/o male with low T @ 313

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    29 y/o male with low T @ 313


    Just looking for some feedback/advice. Had my blood work done a few days ago. Here are some basic numbers and ranges.

    Test: 313 (348-1197)
    LH: 4.6 (1.7-8.6)
    FSH: 1.5 (1.5-12.4)
    Estrodial: 13.9 (7.6-42.6)

    They did not measure free T or any thyroid levels.

    I work at a gym, so workouts are consistent, at least 5/week. I eat really good, a lot of protein, healthy fats, and vegetables. I don't drink or smoke. I have done a few cycles in the past: sust250, (2) test-e, and a couple PH cycles. I always used clomid/nolva/natty test booster for PCT.

    Just not sure where to go from here. Went to an Endo about 2 years ago, test was about the same (low 300's) he said that was low-normal, he stressed the 'normal' I just want my test levels where they should be. Plus, my wife and I will try to get pregnant this summer, so TRT isn't an option. I've read that 25-50mg ED of Clomid can help boost my FSH which would eventually boost my test. I have trib, ZMA, maca, vitex, DAA, Vitamin-D, and A-HD.

    I'm really curious if anyone has been successful with the natural supplement approach or the Clomid approach or anything else without TRT?

    Thank you ahead of time for any help/suggestions!

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    Quote Originally Posted by grippo View Post
    Just looking for some feedback/advice. Had my blood work done a few days ago. Here are some basic numbers and ranges.

    Test: 313 (348-1197)
    LH: 4.6 (1.7-8.6)
    FSH: 1.5 (1.5-12.4)
    Estrodial: 13.9 (7.6-42.6)

    They did not measure free T or any thyroid levels.

    I work at a gym, so workouts are consistent, at least 5/week. I eat really good, a lot of protein, healthy fats, and vegetables. I don't drink or smoke. I have done a few cycles in the past: sust250, (2) test-e, and a couple PH cycles. I always used clomid/nolva/natty test booster for PCT.

    Just not sure where to go from here. Went to an Endo about 2 years ago, test was about the same (low 300's) he said that was low-normal, he stressed the 'normal' I just want my test levels where they should be. Plus, my wife and I will try to get pregnant this summer, so TRT isn't an option. I've read that 25-50mg ED of Clomid can help boost my FSH which would eventually boost my test. I have trib, ZMA, maca, vitex, DAA, Vitamin-D, and A-HD.

    I'm really curious if anyone has been successful with the natural supplement approach or the Clomid approach or anything else without TRT?

    Thank you ahead of time for any help/suggestions!
    You need to look at reason why this is occuring what other hidden imbalances which may be present. There is a specific pattern which I use to help get guys restarted along with their dr's intervention which needs to be supervised along with the proper meds. I have dr's in texas who I work with on these cases. You have way to many variables in the puzzle you need to isolate which ones and explore other areas out side testosteorne which may be preventing your restart. Majority restarts fail because other underlying issues need to be taken care in lieu of the hormone issues which is just a symptom of the cause.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    How much cardio do you do?
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    You need to look at reason why this is occuring what other hidden imbalances which may be present. There is a specific pattern which I use to help get guys restarted along with their dr's intervention which needs to be supervised along with the proper meds. I have dr's in texas who I work with on these cases. You have way to many variables in the puzzle you need to isolate which ones and explore other areas out side testosteorne which may be preventing your restart. Majority restarts fail because other underlying issues need to be taken care in lieu of the hormone issues which is just a symptom of the cause.
    Can you clear a few Pm's, Matrix?
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    I'm actually in St. Louis now (need to update). What do you suggest I start with?

    I usually do 20-40 min of low-intensity cardio 4-5 days/week. This usually consists of walking on the treadmill at 3.0mph with an incline between 5 and 15 degrees.
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    Quote Originally Posted by grippo View Post
    I'm actually in St. Louis now (need to update). What do you suggest I start with?

    I usually do 20-40 min of low-intensity cardio 4-5 days/week. This usually consists of walking on the treadmill at 3.0mph with an incline between 5 and 15 degrees.
    If you can afford to get your own bloodwork done, then get a full anti aging panel done for just under $300 by Labcorp. Cardio will drop your test levels, especially if you do a lot. It doesn't sound like you do an excessive amount, but before you panic, I'd try a few things. First, get the blood panel I mentioned and refrain from any cardio for at least a week. Once you get the results you'll see a lot more than the simple tests you've had in the past. I know you've had two tests a couple of years apart, but it doesn't hurt to get another one. And keep in mind that the normal range may be 3-10 (made up numbers) but the average is clsoer to 3-4. It may be the case that your normal range is at the lower end of the scale. I assume you have no ED issues or anything like that? Do more testing, hold back on the cardio and see what the results are. At least you'll have four pages of tests to refer to instead of the one pager most doctor's order.
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    No ED issues since my last cycle, I had them from a cycle in 2010, probably from an inadequate PCT.

    I have most other symptoms of low T; lethargic, little to no sex drive, I have lost quite a bit of mass, I stay lean everywhere except my mid-section, etc...

    I will try to get a full test done in the next month or so, I will cut out cardio before the test like you suggested.

    Anything I can try in the mean time or is it better to get the full results and go from there?

    Thanks for the suggestions so far!
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    Quote Originally Posted by grippo View Post
    No ED issues since my last cycle, I had them from a cycle in 2010, probably from an inadequate PCT.

    I have most other symptoms of low T; lethargic, little to no sex drive, I have lost quite a bit of mass, I stay lean everywhere except my mid-section, etc...

    I will try to get a full test done in the next month or so, I will cut out cardio before the test like you suggested.

    Anything I can try in the mean time or is it better to get the full results and go from there?

    Thanks for the suggestions so far!
    You need proper evaluation as to why then go from there
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix

    You need proper evaluation as to why then go from there
    Do you have any recommendations for someone in the St. Louis area or can you PM me one? Your inbox is full. Thanks
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    I got my package of Clomid today and I am going to run the clomid restart, what is the best dosage? Most of what I read shows 25mg/EOD
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    As many are finding out they may fail the challenge because other lying issues where not addressed. This is why sometimes it takes 4 months to.prep a person for a restart. We have had several people fail first time then 4 months later go from 300's to.prior challenge to over 700-800 second time around. The standard protocol used is50 mgs daily for 7 days. Many have found side.effects on this but 25 mgs ed for 7 days test on 8 th day. Then adjust dosage according from 12.5 mgs to 25 mgs eod. I am working with several guys under medical supervising prepping them for restarts. People mind sets are changing about trt. We used to get people pissed because we would not give them hrt right off the bat. Many people who have been cursing it now have been finding it a blessing since being on trt was making them feel good but was masking much deeper issues which would have compromised their health in the future. Just Imagine how.many younger guys where possible put on trt which never needed in the first place but now are showing up with thyroid, adrenal and other issues being masked. Just food for thought.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by grippo
    I got my package of Clomid today and I am going to run the clomid restart, what is the best dosage? Most of what I read shows 25mg/EOD
    I did Clomid @25mg ED and it brought my levels from a 192 to a 720....I was very pleased with this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lboston View Post
    I did Clomid @25mg ED and it brought my levels from a 192 to a 720....I was very pleased with this.
    Problem is after 3-4 months your body can down regulate seen it happen even at 25 mgs per day. After stopping it for 3-4 weeks starting at much lowered dosages he's been holding 750 like clock work a year later.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix

    Problem is after 3-4 months your body can down regulate seen it happen even at 25 mgs per day. After stopping it for 3-4 weeks starting at much lowered dosages he's been holding 750 like clock work a year later.
    So, would 3-4 weeks at 25mg EOD be a good start? Are there any support supplements recommended during the clomid run?
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    Quote Originally Posted by lboston

    I did Clomid @25mg ED and it brought my levels from a 192 to a 720....I was very pleased with this.
    How long did you run this?
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    Quote Originally Posted by grippo

    How long did you run this?
    6 weeks. While on the Clomid we found out my wife was pregnant, so I'm now on test cyp weekly injects. Like matrix said, you can desensitize to the Clomid, so it's so it's not a long term plan, but it may certainly work in the short term--few years--time span.

    My urologist recommended the Clomid as fertility was my primary concern. Plus, it will more than likely boost the sperm count as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lboston

    6 weeks. While on the Clomid we found out my wife was pregnant, so I'm now on test cyp weekly injects. Like matrix said, you can desensitize to the Clomid, so it's so it's not a long term plan, but it may certainly work in the short term--few years--time span.

    My urologist recommended the Clomid as fertility was my primary concern. Plus, it will more than likely boost the sperm count as well.
    Fertility is a concern of mine, but overall, I want a restart. Depending on other conditions, is there a chance that a short-term Clomid restart can 'fix' the issue or does the effect wear off 6 months down the road?
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    When deal with creating an optimun environment for restart to occur involves neurology, psychology, Endocrinology, immunology, nutrition, toxicology, gastrology. It is no simply task, but in the end its well worth it.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by grippo

    Fertility is a concern of mine, but overall, I want a restart. Depending on other conditions, is there a chance that a short-term Clomid restart can 'fix' the issue or does the effect wear off 6 months down the road?
    There's certainly a chance if you can find a doc willing to do the Clomid therapy. Of course, you could always do it solo, but I'm not sure what that outcome would be.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lboston View Post
    There's certainly a chance if you can find a doc willing to do the Clomid therapy. Of course, you could always do it solo, but I'm not sure what that outcome would be.
    It will not hold or work unless you have other factors in check..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Thanks for the advice/replies. I'm getting blood work tomorrow (I'll post all my #'s) and I'm gonna run the clomid test starting Monday. If it doesn't hold up, then I'll go to a doctor. Anyone have any recommendations for a doctor in the St. Louis area?
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    Quote Originally Posted by grippo
    Thanks for the advice/replies. I'm getting blood work tomorrow (I'll post all my #'s) and I'm gonna run the clomid test starting Monday. If it doesn't hold up, then I'll go to a doctor. Anyone have any recommendations for a doctor in the St. Louis area?
    St Louis is a big area--I'd ask around and find yourself a good urologist that specializes in fertility. They'd have you covered from both ends..
  

  
 

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