4 Weeks into HRT, Painful Lumps Under Nipples

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    Unhappy 4 Weeks into HRT, Painful Lumps Under Nipples


    I'm 4 weeks into a new HRT protocol that has me doing 100mg injections twice weekly and 500iu HCG twice weekly.

    I had previously used 5g daily of Androgel without any problems, but little effectiveness.

    I'm developing painful bumps directly under the nipples, that as best I can describe, feels like a rock would inside your shoes everytime you take a step. I really cant tell if they are getting puffy as I have a decent bit of fat built up at the moment.

    Like I said, I have had no problems with the Androgel in the past or 10 years ago when I would run the topical 4AD products and such.

    I am a little hesitant to tell the doc because I see him just discontinuing the test injections, which I really do not want to do.

    Should I be running the typical ancillary items: 1mg Anastrozole EOD or 20-40mg Novadex daily or possibly Exemestane or Letrozole?

    Hopefully someone has had the same experience and can share what he did to help resolve this. Hopefully I am catching it early enough to whee it can be easily reversed. Any help would be appreciated.

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    Quote Originally Posted by custom View Post
    I'm 4 weeks into a new HRT protocol that has me doing 100mg injections twice weekly and 500iu HCG twice weekly.

    I had previously used 5g daily of Androgel without any problems, but little effectiveness.

    I'm developing painful bumps directly under the nipples, that as best I can describe, feels like a rock would inside your shoes everytime you take a step. I really cant tell if they are getting puffy as I have a decent bit of fat built up at the moment.

    Like I said, I have had no problems with the Androgel in the past or 10 years ago when I would run the topical 4AD products and such.

    I am a little hesitant to tell the doc because I see him just discontinuing the test injections, which I really do not want to do.

    Should I be running the typical ancillary items: 1mg Anastrozole EOD or 20-40mg Novadex daily or possibly Exemestane or Letrozole?

    Hopefully someone has had the same experience and can share what he did to help resolve this. Hopefully I am catching it early enough to whee it can be easily reversed. Any help would be appreciated.
    Stop going to cookie cutter anti aging clinics and this would not happen. Get to a proper Dr, even at the age of 33 why was your testosterone low in the first place? I would have other areas evaluated with a good Dr. Which I can give recommendation in your area to.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    I've suffered a TRT realated gyno lump in my left.

    1st all I can say is your dose of both test and HCG is right at the top end you could simply try bringing down to the minimum 50mg test twice a week and 100iu of HCG twice a week see if that resolves the problem then slowly work up finding your optimal safe dose.


    After I got the lump Dr had no clue with what to do. (Option 1 less than 100mg test a week. Option 2 Crysin cream) I ended up ordering Letro from an overseas pharmacy and got rid of it myself following a standard letro protocol. Now after some fast talking Dr prescribes and allows .25 of a Anastozole daily and this seems to work. The lump I had is like an inbuilt alarm now if my E is out for just a day it starts to hurt this is annoying but helpful.

    If your not to far developed a drop in dose might be enough to resolve the problem if it doesn't you will have to introduce other drugs ... something you should try avoid if possible!

    Remember what you save in test now can always be used for a cycle later
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    Stop going to cookie cutter anti aging clinics and this would not happen. Get to a proper Dr, even at the age of 33 why was your testosterone low in the first place? I would have other areas evaluated with a good Dr. Which I can give recommendation in your area to.

    It is actually a specialized Endocrinologist who holds area seminars for other docs unfamiliar with HRT. That being said, I could see his first reaction to be discontinuing the injection and revert back to the cream, which I really do not want to do, hence the thread here. He was literally the 5th Dr I had to go to in order to get treatment, so obviously I do not want to rock the boat much. I literally had a Dr refuse to treat me because he said I was too young to be having the problem I was having...which you thin would mean I would be a prime candidate for RT> Unfortunately, there is so much ignorance amongst the medical community for HRT in general and even moreso for those under 35, it is insane.

    Quote Originally Posted by aj power View Post
    I've suffered a TRT realated gyno lump in my left.

    1st all I can say is your dose of both test and HCG is right at the top end you could simply try bringing down to the minimum 50mg test twice a week and 100iu of HCG twice a week see if that resolves the problem then slowly work up finding your optimal safe dose.


    After I got the lump Dr had no clue with what to do. (Option 1 less than 100mg test a week. Option 2 Crysin cream) I ended up ordering Letro from an overseas pharmacy and got rid of it myself following a standard letro protocol. Now after some fast talking Dr prescribes and allows .25 of a Anastozole daily and this seems to work. The lump I had is like an inbuilt alarm now if my E is out for just a day it starts to hurt this is annoying but helpful.

    If your not to far developed a drop in dose might be enough to resolve the problem if it doesn't you will have to introduce other drugs ... something you should try avoid if possible!

    Remember what you save in test now can always be used for a cycle later
    Thanks. I have access to the ancillary drugs that would be faster and easier than anything, I just really want to know what would be the drug of choice and dose and duration needed. So any other input there would be appreciated.

    Also, could the HCG be causing this, or would it just be possible for the test to cause it? Just to be safe, though, I will taper down the dose of both to try and fix this ASAP.
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    With guys under 35, i tend to.try to isolate the cause because as i.have found out dealing with this for.many years is there are issue which need to be addressed which will complement hrt or them to get off of it.all together. With way.medical system is going you.never know when the rug will.be pulled out from us. I do not want to fall victim to the system relying on them to.support my quality of life. Idea of relying on a drug rest of.my.life does not.sit well with me. I already did the.impossible getting of hc which people told.me i be condemned for life and i am off thyroid which i.was on for over 6-7 years. Now working on getting of hrt at 39. i obviously have disproved medical drs and the general mentality of the internet gurus out there.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Hey AJ doesn't a daily dose of Adex throw off your lipids? I keep hearing bad things about adex lowering IGF levels,lipid issues and possible rebound
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    HCG raises Estrogen levels by stimulating aromatase in the testes, the testosterone converts before hitting the blood stream. I use 2.5mg of Letro once weekly to prevent sides from HRT. I waiting on my blood test now to see where it puts me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fanzdslpwr1 View Post
    Hey AJ doesn't a daily dose of Adex throw off your lipids? I keep hearing bad things about adex lowering IGF levels,lipid issues and possible rebound
    Why one uses armosin which does not affect these parameters.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by custom View Post
    I'm 4 weeks into a new HRT protocol that has me doing 100mg injections twice weekly and 500iu HCG twice weekly.

    I had previously used 5g daily of Androgel without any problems, but little effectiveness.

    I'm developing painful bumps directly under the nipples, that as best I can describe, feels like a rock would inside your shoes everytime you take a step. I really cant tell if they are getting puffy as I have a decent bit of fat built up at the moment.

    Like I said, I have had no problems with the Androgel in the past or 10 years ago when I would run the topical 4AD products and such.

    I am a little hesitant to tell the doc because I see him just discontinuing the test injections, which I really do not want to do.

    Should I be running the typical ancillary items: 1mg Anastrozole EOD or 20-40mg Novadex daily or possibly Exemestane or Letrozole?

    Hopefully someone has had the same experience and can share what he did to help resolve this. Hopefully I am catching it early enough to whee it can be easily reversed. Any help would be appreciated.
    As stated previously, 200mg weekly is a tad bit high and will put you at about 1400 total test. If you have a high affinity for testosterone aromatization it could be an estradiol issue.

    I would imaging that you should be scheduled to be getting blood work again here real soon. If you can tolerate the discomfort a little longer, if it were me, I would hold off to get an assessment of your present protocol through actual blood work which should be the doctors plan anyway. This way he can address the data. If the data shows evidence of elevated estradiol then it would explain your symptoms and allow him to treat you with the proper ancillaries or an adjusted protocol.

    Like yourself, I know how hard it can be to get treatment in the first place. I would be hesitant to ruin the relationship with unnecessary disclosure at this very moment nor would I personally alter his treatment plan until then. JMHO
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    Quote Originally Posted by custom View Post
    It is actually a specialized Endocrinologist who holds area seminars for other docs unfamiliar with HRT. That being said, I could see his first reaction to be discontinuing the injection and revert back to the cream, which I really do not want to do, hence the thread here. He was literally the 5th Dr I had to go to in order to get treatment, so obviously I do not want to rock the boat much. I literally had a Dr refuse to treat me because he said I was too young to be having the problem I was having...which you thin would mean I would be a prime candidate for RT> Unfortunately, there is so much ignorance amongst the medical community for HRT in general and even moreso for those under 35, it is insane.



    Thanks. I have access to the ancillary drugs that would be faster and easier than anything, I just really want to know what would be the drug of choice and dose and duration needed. So any other input there would be appreciated.

    Also, could the HCG be causing this, or would it just be possible for the test to cause it? Just to be safe, though, I will taper down the dose of both to try and fix this ASAP.
    If you have a solid lump Letro is your best friend it worked for me but it comes with nasty sides. Armidex and Chrysin wont reduce a solid lump in my experience. From what I have read on this board HCG is more likely to cause E related issues but in my case I got my lump when I was on Test and Test alone (Reandron - 1000mg every 7-8 weeks)

    Quote Originally Posted by fanzdslpwr1 View Post
    Hey AJ doesn't a daily dose of Adex throw off your lipids? I keep hearing bad things about adex lowering IGF levels,lipid issues and possible rebound
    Since starting TRT and using Adex/Arimidex my IGF level has moved up and up according to blood testing. First test was average last test was in the optimal range I think test can and does this tho. I haven't tested my lipids in a while so don't know ... I really should address this rather important issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    Why one uses armosin which does not affect these parameters.
    Once you have any solid lump gone this is probably the drug of choice if that's the way you want to roll ...
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    isn't Erase very similar to Aromasin?
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Dunn View Post
    As stated previously, 200mg weekly is a tad bit high and will put you at about 1400 total test. If you have a high affinity for testosterone aromatization it could be an estradiol issue.

    I would imaging that you should be scheduled to be getting blood work again here real soon. If you can tolerate the discomfort a little longer, if it were me, I would hold off to get an assessment of your present protocol through actual blood work which should be the doctors plan anyway. This way he can address the data. If the data shows evidence of elevated estradiol then it would explain your symptoms and allow him to treat you with the proper ancillaries or an adjusted protocol.

    Like yourself, I know how hard it can be to get treatment in the first place. I would be hesitant to ruin the relationship with unnecessary disclosure at this very moment nor would I personally alter his treatment plan until then. JMHO
    Sound advice as always; thanks very much.

    Quote Originally Posted by aj power View Post
    If you have a solid lump Letro is your best friend it worked for me but it comes with nasty sides. Armidex and Chrysin wont reduce a solid lump in my experience. From what I have read on this board HCG is more likely to cause E related issues but in my case I got my lump when I was on Test and Test alone (Reandron - 1000mg every 7-8 weeks)

    ...
    What kind of sides are you referring to with Letro? Just curious.
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    Can a quality DIM supplement be used with TRT instead of a prescription anti-estrogen?
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    Quote Originally Posted by fanzdslpwr1 View Post
    Can a quality DIM supplement be used with TRT instead of a prescription anti-estrogen?
    Correcting liver pathways and GI imbalances will help correct e2 issues
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    yes but can the DIM be used for this purpose?
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    Quote Originally Posted by fanzdslpwr1 View Post
    yes but can the DIM be used for this purpose?
    Yes it can but it depends on the person biochemistry. There are instances where I see DIM cause issues with people due to their bioindividuality.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    like what kind of issues are possible?
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    With Letro I got real stupid. Foggy brain couldn't remember anybodys name etc also joints were starting to ache like hell but I have bad joints anyway.

    I had to use 2.5mg a day for about 50 days to get rid if the lump completely.
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    Quote Originally Posted by aj power View Post
    With Letro I got real stupid. Foggy brain couldn't remember anybodys name etc also joints were starting to ache like hell but I have bad joints anyway.

    I had to use 2.5mg a day for about 50 days to get rid if the lump completely.
    You got rid of the lump at the expense of putting your risk of potential depression and other mental disorders...Women are using this stuff and I had one client some idiot at the gym told her to take it. She finally told me what she was doing. I gave her 2 choices either listen to my recommendation or listen to his? It took me 8 months to get her straight of just being on the stuff for 8 weeks. She learned the lesson the hard way
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    what issues are possible with DIM?
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    2.5mgs of Letro weekly w/HRT left with these blood values. Schedule went like this,
    Sat: 2.5mg Letro
    Sun: 120mgs Test E
    Mon: 450iu HCG
    Tues: off
    Wed: Blood test

    Test Description Result Range Units
    Estradiol004519 21.6 7.6-42.6 pg/mL
    Roche ECLIA methodology


    Test Description Result Range Units
    Testosterone, Serum004227 932 348-1197 ng/dL
    Free Testosterone(Direct)144981 31 8.7-25.1 pg/mL
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    I have been having major bouts of depression for over 10 years and have been on various drugs to treat it. I can say with absolute certainty the Letro had no effect in that area on me during the time I took it. (Lucky perhaps IDK). My lump was not small by any means and was not directly under the nipple at first both Dr and ultra sound person suspected it was something much worse than what it was. It hurt like hell and when I went to the surgeon for removal he said because of the ill defined edge i.e its spread into your muscle and has vain like structures I will need to remove your entire left chest to be sure to get it all he also gave some ill informed advice on other options ... I considered the risk to benefit ratio I took the risk with o/s pharmacy and letro ... it paid off I still have a functioning left chest muscle and no lump at all. I consider that in the circumstances I made the right choice.

    On that note I just recently added in 100mg a day of pregnenolone to my HRT after four days and feeling a lot better I stopped taking my Anti depressants without side effect. Previously if I missed a pill I was bed ridden by the evening! its still early days but no signs of depression have returned I have major memory improvements as well as functioning level during the day ... so far so good but it has only been a few weeks.
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    Custom,

    I'd really consider blood test, they can be ordered on your own. I posted the above to show that even with low doses an AI is needed to control estrogen by some people. Letro is one of the few drugs known to reverse gyno after it becomes glandular.
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    instead of going with the AI route. Can DHT compounds be used to rid the gyno?
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    Quote Originally Posted by fanzdslpwr1 View Post
    instead of going with the AI route. Can DHT compounds be used to rid the gyno?
    Its not well studied, but in theory yes. I would not go by theory alone...
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    I was curious because some people are getting rid of gyno with AndroHard after a few months. I would think that would be better and beneficial on the body just as long someone isn't prone to DHT sides.
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    hello,

    im on androgel and hcg.

    i can feel them work in my body.
    i would say drop the T by 25% and take 9oiu hcg 5 days a week.
    throw in some DIM and calcium d glucorate and voila.

    if you feel a lump, do something about it pronto.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bad rad View Post
    2.5mgs of Letro weekly w/HRT left with these blood values. Schedule went like this,
    Sat: 2.5mg Letro
    Sun: 120mgs Test E
    Mon: 450iu HCG
    Tues: off
    Wed: Blood test

    Test Description Result Range Units
    Estradiol004519 21.6 7.6-42.6 pg/mL
    Roche ECLIA methodology


    Test Description Result Range Units
    Testosterone, Serum004227 932 348-1197 ng/dL
    Free Testosterone(Direct)144981 31 8.7-25.1 pg/mL
    Who was the Genius that thought this backasswards approach up?
    Your numbers may look good, but could have been done a little different with less need for AI even if any..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    Correcting liver pathways and GI imbalances will help correct e2 issues

    What kind of tests would one get to determine if there are issues in these areas?
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    Who was the Genius that thought this backasswards approach up?
    Your numbers may look good, but could have been done a little different with less need for AI even if any..
    I promise you that there is no way that his E2 is 21.6 on 120mg of test e and 2.5mg of Letro after 4 weeks or more.
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    Sorry, but what's a DIM?
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