Experienced INSULIN users: Diet questions

Matthersby

Matthersby

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Hello there!
In my bulking prep for next year's MP, I am adding Novolin-R to my post workout routine. I have used Slin before and have spent an obnoxious amount of time researching safe protocols and practices over the last 2 years...
Here's what I am curious about....
I typically workout from 6-715PM every evening. This is not ideal for post workout insulin use. I'm not exactly looking for an excuse to go to sleep during novolin-r's "peak" but I'd like to be comfortable after the peak going to sleep.
Here is a breakdown of my diet plan+additional Slin routine:
-I'm 245 lbs btw:


- Meal: 7 egg whites, 3 eggs, 1 cup grape nuts, 1 cup skim milk
- Meal: 2 cans tuna, light mayo, 2 slices Ezekiel bread, 3 large pickles
- Meal: 1-1/2 cups rice, 1 cup pinto or black beans, 6 oz ground beef(80/20)

- Post workout: 8iu's Novolin-R, 60 gm's dextrose, 60 gm's whey, 5 gm's creatine mono, 5 gm's amino complex(BCAAs+glutamine)
- Every 15 minutes: 5-10 gm's dextrose
- 60 minutes post injection: 2 chicken breasts, 2 cups white rice, 1/2 cup beans, can of sweet corn
- 3 hours post injection: 1-1/2 cups low fat cottage cheese, cup of pasta, 3/4 cup low fat PB.

This puts me at roughly 4200 cals:
- 520gm's carbs
- 360gm's protein
- 70gm's fat

I am doing something that you're really not supposed to do and that's adjusting my carbs for my insulin dose, not my insulin dose for my carb needs. This would not be the case if I were able to use Slin during the day as I would most likely keep my adequate amount of carbs the same (I'm on a bulk) and simply add the dextrose(typical macros+slin+{7-10gm'sXper slin IU}) time my post workout meal @60minutes, and watch for any signs and symptoms of hypoglycemia for next 5-7 hours....

Instead I'm adding pasta at 1145 at night for a pre-bed meal putting me a bit more over my bulking cals every day.

I do not wish to gain a lot of body fat on this bulk, and since May, due to all the anabolics I'm also running(test,trest,msten) it hasn't been an issue, I've leaned out slightly.

Am I only to be concerned with the dextrose needed alongside slin and keep the next 2 meals the same as I nornally would? Or should I keep the carb-dense food in there during my 5 hour slin "peak" to prevent hypo?

Hope I explained this well for you. I'm pretty cautious but I'd rather not gain an obnoxious amount of fat out of a fear of using slin 5 hours before bed and not waking up.

Thanks!
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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Bump for the day crew. Maybe I'm in the wrong section.
 

warlordwrug

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Why Novolin-R? Why not use a fast acting Novolog or use a long acting like lantus/levemir? I never understood the use I can see from a legal perspective since you don't need a prescription
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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Ya. Just the ease of purchasing. Walk into Walmart, $35 gets me 100 slinpins and 1000 ius of insulin.
 
reps4jesus

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Take it preworkout then maybe, I take mine an hour and a half preworkout and use the same protocol timing meal wise, then I sip on Gatorade during my workout and get another meal right after I lift.
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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I'm gonna check out Palumbo's preworkout protocol. Do you think I should do all of the creatine, bcaa's, whey all preworkout alongside the dextrose? PS I'm up to 12ius now and can get by with about 5-6 grams Dex alongside it without going hypo.
 
reps4jesus

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I take mine all in a shake pwo with slin and I do fine as long as I get a meal right when I'm done lifting and I get some simple carbs while lifting. I do 10ius pwo or I do 5 pre and 5 post. Not to much in the way of fat gain thus far. I wouldn't recommend R post actually, humalog would be perfect because of the fast spike for that post workout meal but R stays in your system so long and takes so long to peak that you'll actually be peaking right about the time your eating post workout. If you time it right.
 
reps4jesus

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I would never go to sleep on 12ius until about hour 6-7 at the latest. Everyone is different. I just go hypo very quick even Into hour 5-7 sleeping would probably kill me. I'm not even on gear and I'm still doing well using the the pwo regimine of slin. igf1, and HGH help me keep fat gain minimal, however.

Edit: also get some humalog, this will fix this entire issue and you can use it post workout as long as its 3-4 hours from bedtime.
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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Yes. I did some reading today. I guess I was so caught up in the hassle of trying to recognize hypo during a workout(I know everyone says this but my workouts are ridiculous, doubled over between sets, dizzy, completely soaked shirt) It may be hard to recognize hypo with the intensity that I try to maintain. I didn't realize how much more ideal preworkout slin is since there are so many postwo protocols.
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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I would never go to sleep on 12ius until about hour 6-7 at the latest. Everyone is different. I just go hypo very quick even Into hour 5-7 sleeping would probably kill me. I'm not even on gear and I'm still doing well using the the pwo regimine of slin. igf1, and HGH help me keep fat gain minimal, however.

Edit: also get some humalog, this will fix this entire issue and you can use it post workout as long as its 3-4 hours from bedtime.
Abosloutely. I'm 255 right now and paying out of pocket for trt . I'm spending $800 a month on food for me and my wife(who trains harder than most men) so I've been being frugal. I'm also going through a bottle of letro every 2 weeks since I'm running trest on my cruise as well. This fuggin hobby is expensive!
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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The only way I've gone to sleep is right about 5 hours post inj and with a belly full of carbs and protein. Ugh, I can't remember the last time I ate when I was hungry..... :/
 
reps4jesus

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Abosloutely. I'm 255 right now and paying out of pocket for trt . I'm spending $800 a month on food for me and my wife(who trains harder than most men) so I've been being frugal. I'm also going through a bottle of letro every 2 weeks since I'm running trest on my cruise as well. This fuggin hobby is expensive!
So true, if your in it for the money its the wrong sport. If you can afford to throw in igf1 at least on workout days at about 50-70mcg pwo (recombinant, not the rc stuff) it really pays off keeping you lean while running the slin. Its not crazy expensive just takes a while to find the real deal, Cheaper than hgh at least. It gives you a little flexibility with your diet without you turning into a cow like you would on slin alone lol
 
reps4jesus

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The only way I've gone to sleep is right about 5 hours post inj and with a belly full of carbs and protein. Ugh, I can't remember the last time I ate when I was hungry..... :/
5 hours is when I peak so its a **** show if I mess up around 4-5 hour mark, you obviously know what your doing though and can adjust food intake accordingly to when you'll sleep. And for real man, I'm so sick of eating lol
 
reps4jesus

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Yes. I did some reading today. I guess I was so caught up in the hassle of trying to recognize hypo during a workout(I know everyone says this but my workouts are ridiculous, doubled over between sets, dizzy, completely soaked shirt) It may be hard to recognize hypo with the intensity that I try to maintain. I didn't realize how much more ideal preworkout slin is since there are so many postwo protocols.
Nice! just keep some glucose tabs on hand and maybe Check your levels half way through your workout to see how you handle it. Good luck man. Let us know how it goes
 
Matthersby

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So, survived my first session. 10iu's preworkout. Had a drink with 10gm's creatine, 10gms BCAA, 50 gms whey(sipped on throughout workout)and got my dextrose from tabs. By the time 90 minute arm n shoulder session was up I'd probably taken down 160-200gms of dextrose(including the 60 I took alongside the slin).
I wonder if this is too much? However, I didn't need as much once home. Just did 6oz OJ and 30more gms of whey. Had rice pasta and ground turkey after 45-60 minutes or so.
 
reps4jesus

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That's a lot of dextrose man. No need for 200g Dex for 10ius slin. I think you got in your own head and wanted to play it safe. 60 intra workout would have probably done the job no problem. I take 10ius pwo and I one get down a total of 60g dextrose half with my slin and half I get from Gatorade while lifting. I also take another 5 ius of slin post workout and I don't take any Dex, I just have my meal and a couple of gummy bears for glucose.
 
Matthersby

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Ya. This is what I was concerned with. I train at 6000 feet elevation, and I'm not in great cardiovascular shape. My workouts are intense and every set feels like I go hypo anyways. So difficult to tell for me.
 
Matthersby

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Gonna drop down to 10iu/100gms, 50 w slin, 50 throughout. And drop down each workout. Training solo yesterday was a big part why I played it so safe. I usually train with my wife who knows exactly what to look for
 
reps4jesus

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Gonna drop down to 10iu/100gms, 50 w slin, 50 throughout. And drop down each workout. Training solo yesterday was a big part why I played it so safe. I usually train with my wife who knows exactly what to look for
That sounds smart man. Its better to play it safe. Taking 10ius pre and then 4-5 post is something to think about. I never get hypo symptoms on the second pin.
 
Matthersby

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Enjoying the hell out of some of these workouts with slin-pumps. I'm to the point where I can subq 10iu's 45 minutes prior and sip on a sugary drink until the workout begins. I almost always have 30-50 grams of whey around this time and 50 more combining my bcaa's, creatine, and whey through the workout.. I still use close to 100grams of sugars throughout the workout as well but I'm not comfortable going lower than that. Its far too tricky to recognize hypo during my type of workout, the elevation, my 255lb azz sweating like a fat boy. I'm cycling off everything and cruising on test for the next 10-12 weeks and am just hoping to maintain my size until I start a early cut. I think if would be a lot easier to bulk at 9% less bf.
 
Matthersby

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I'll be looking into getting some glucophage and faster acting slin to add to some GH that Ill be between blasts and working up to 16 weekz out from next November's NPC.
 

j_100801

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hello Matthersby,

i also workout at the end of the day, 18:00 usually, and i take humalog 3x day on training days only, 8iu at a time.

first insulin is right after breakfast around 8:30 (my breakfast is 50gr why isolate, carbs with low GI like oatmeal or muesli (about 40gr of oatmeal cooked in water and a bit milk, together with fruit like apple or banana). my next meal is a normal meal 2 hours later. i know people say take the next meal 1 hr later, but i think that only makes you fat and is not nesc if you have plenty carbs when you take insulin.

second insulin is right after meal around 13:00,

the third insulin i take pre workout!! not after!! i take 10iu HGH, wait 30 minutes, take 8iu insulin together with 30gr whey isolate, 30gr maltodextrine, 5 gr bcaa, 5 gr creatine. prepare for gym, and then about 30 min after i took the insulin i go to gym thats 5 min from my house, so i start working out +/- 30 min after the insulin shot together with the big shake. then during workout i take shake 30gr dextrose, 5 gr bcaa, 5 gr creatine, 30gr whey isolate.

when i get home from gym i take a normal meal (chicken or beef +/- 200-250gr, together with 150gr rice or couscous, bulgur, pasta, 150gr veggies)

this works great for me. i eat about 3500kcal a day, prot:carbs:fat 50:40:10, each meal is about 500kcal, i take about 7 meals a day. so pretty small meals.'

i have done also 10iu insulin this way and i dont get fat on it. but i eat very clean and as said i eat small meals each time. i would defenitely not use anything else besides humalog or novarapid because the peak of those is gone after 2 hours. so chances i get into hypo because i can not eat are very very slim. have done other insulin in the past even up to 15iu and got in hypo few times and can tell you for me never again. its not worth the risk. sometimes something happens and i could not get my second meal in properly and BOEM hypo and floored!

hope this helps
 

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