PCT with ICF-1 or SARM S4

stormballer33

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IGF-1 Long R3 or Sarm S-4


started a hdrol/x tren cycle for 6 weeks at 75/90 mgs respectively. Was wondering which would be beter to incorporate PCT with Nolva /Clomid? Does one take longer than the other to produce strength and size results?

Since losing strength is an issue sometimes while on pct would adding one of these products help in maintaing and/or gaining muscle? If anyone has any first had experience using it while on PCT it would be appreciated.
 
CrazyChemist

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You should have your PCT straightened out before starting cycle. Nolva and clomid are SERMs and usually form the base of PCT. I think most on this site have experience with the cmpds and, yes, they will help recovery during PCT. I think this was your question, right? If you're asking whether nolva is better over clomid or vice versa, no they are both SERMs and using one over another is preference. Clomid is more commonly seen in PCT and nolva is more commonly seen on cycle to suppress high estro levels but thats just in my limited experience talking to others.
 
CrazyChemist

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Ahh just realized you were actually asking about ICF-1 or SARM S4, sorry. I dont have experience with either but I know alot of ppl run ICF-1 after their cycle. IDK if they wait till they finish PCT.
 

stormballer33

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IGF-1 Long R3 or SARM S4? I have read a few ppl sing both but im not made of money and with ph and serm and everyhting else my bank account i a little low so looking for some advice.

what about running pct then after pct running IGF-1 Long R3 or SARM S4 with allbuterol and cutting ???
 

dpfisher

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IGF-1 because it reverses testicular atrophy quickly.

Nobody's really sure what the effects of S4 are in PCT yet. IGF-1 can help gyno tissue formation, but if estro is under control then it will be fine.

Lots of people have used IGF-1 in PCT and maintained most or all of their gains. A few people have used S4 in PCT and said, "Well I feel better so it must be good." Take your pick.
 
CrazyChemist

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IGF-1 because it reverses testicular atrophy quickly.
I bet this is true but can you provide a ref. I'd just like to read the literature. Good posting btw.
 

dpfisher

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I bet this is true but can you provide a ref. I'd just like to read the literature. Good posting btw.
Sorry all I got is broscience... people say that even on cycle it will make your nuts come back.
 
EasyEJL

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S4 is risky, the visual side effects worry me
 
EasyEJL

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well, it varies some depending on dose, but people get loss of night vision, vision discoloration and other weird visual sides from it. Also although pitched originally as non-suppressive it seems that at certain doses it is suppressive. so its a little wishy washy to me
 
CrazyChemist

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well, it varies some depending on dose, but people get loss of night vision, vision discoloration and other weird visual sides from it. Also although pitched originally as non-suppressive it seems that at certain doses it is suppressive. so its a little wishy washy to me
Good to know. Now that you mention it I do recall an issue with vision problems - thanks for reminding me.
 
EasyEJL

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yeah, it sounded promising, but looking at the world thru amber tinted eyeballs scares the piss out of me, even if its only while on cycle. If they know what the cause of it was, I might feel better :)
 
tyler4

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yeah, it sounded promising, but looking at the world thru amber tinted eyeballs scares the piss out of me, even if its only while on cycle. If they know what the cause of it was, I might feel better :)
I suspect the vision problem could be because it was dosed too high. I havent seen where anyone had vision problems at 50mg, only 100mg and higher.

Or it could be because of bunk stuff. I've just recently started to research S4 so I could be off base here.
 
EasyEJL

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I've found a couple people it happened to at 50, but you are right for most people 50mg seems "safe". but even so, that just seems like a way scarier side than my balls shrinking and acne :D and there are no 5 years out studies on it yet, which is part of my concern. Even though a lot of the designer anabolics have no studies either, their effects and side effects are pretty much the same as the older anabolics. S4 is maybe 2-3 years old?
 
tyler4

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I've found a couple people it happened to at 50, but you are right for most people 50mg seems "safe". but even so, that just seems like a way scarier side than my balls shrinking and acne :D and there are no 5 years out studies on it yet, which is part of my concern. Even though a lot of the designer anabolics have no studies either, their effects and side effects are pretty much the same as the older anabolics. S4 is maybe 2-3 years old?
Well I guess it comes down to personal preference. I'd much rather deal with blurry vision than trying to make sure my natural testosterone rebounds to normal. Due to certain hormone levels, at 25 I cant afford to be supressing my T anymore because I'm scared it wont come back,lol. And I still need to have kids! But to each is own.
 

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