Alcohol

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    EC is nowhere near the same, assuming you mean ephedrine and caffeine. There’s MOUNTAINS of research on the combination.
    Meth is made from ephedrine btw... Anything speedy is a gateway to stronger stuff. Humans develop tolerance quickly and need more and more. If your a born addict then you should avoid anything you cannot use without moderation.


  2. Had an issue with alcohol as well. One day got into fitness and that saved my life. Eventually started competing, placed in the top 5 in my first show and the rest is history. I am very proud of doing the right thing with my health. Focusing on fitness keeps me straight because since I love going to the gym so much, I know I can't drink in excess or my performance the next day will suffer. So if I'm getting ready for a show I do not drink during contest prep and if its the offseason I limit my drinking to a couple times a month in moderation. For example a nice dinner out with some good red wine.

    I'm glad I didn't need professional help to quit my bad drinking habits. Good luck to you and stay strong.
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by bigsmall View Post
    Meth is made from ephedrine btw... Anything speedy is a gateway to stronger stuff. Humans develop tolerance quickly and need more and more. If your a born addict then you should avoid anything you cannot use without moderation.
    It is also made with Acetone, Lithium, Ammonia, Red Phosphorus, Sulfuric Acid, etc.
    Ingredients that largely makeup batteries, paint thinner, brake fluid, drain cleaner.

    Ephedrine is HARDLY the issue in meth. Lol

  4. Quote Originally Posted by rascal14 View Post
    It is also made with Acetone, Lithium, Ammonia, Red Phosphorus, Sulfuric Acid, etc.
    Ingredients that largely makeup batteries, paint thinner, brake fluid, drain cleaner.

    Ephedrine is HARDLY the issue in meth. Lol
    My comment was in the light of addiction - in that Ephedrine is a gateway. Ephedrine is the ingredient in Meth that gets you high - the other ingredients you mentioned are for converting copious amounts of Ephedrine into the final product and for making that product usable. I agree these ingredients are not good for you - but folks on this forum (or anywhere unless they are using Meth or Cocaine) I am thinking don't injest the other ingredients. However, they do injest ephedrine.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by bigsmall View Post
    My comment was in the light of addiction - in that Ephedrine is a gateway. Ephedrine is the ingredient in Meth that gets you high - the other ingredients you mentioned are for converting copious amounts of Ephedrine into the final product and for making that product usable. I agree these ingredients are not good for you - but folks on this forum (or anywhere unless they are using Meth or Cocaine) I am thinking don't injest the other ingredients. However, they do injest ephedrine.
    Lol no. There’s mountains of research on ephedrine, and it is not a “gateway drug.” If ephedrine has to be converted into something while making meth, it’s not actually ephedrine that’s getting you high, so just taking ephedrine doesn’t carry any of that same risk.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by bigsmall View Post
    Meth is made from ephedrine btw... Anything speedy is a gateway to stronger stuff. Humans develop tolerance quickly and need more and more. If your a born addict then you should avoid anything you cannot use without moderation.
    Is caffeine not “speedy” or a “stimulant?” And do humans not build tolerance to it? So now addicts should abstain from caffeine? Just because ephedrine is used in meth doesn’t mean that their addictive potential is even remotely similar. It’s beyond fallacious logic. Grapes are used to make wine, should addicts abstain from eating grapes?
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  7. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    Is caffeine not “speedy” or a “stimulant?” And do humans not build tolerance to it? So now addicts should abstain from caffeine? Just because ephedrine is used in meth doesn’t mean that their addictive potential is even remotely similar. It’s beyond fallacious logic. Grapes are used to make wine, should addicts abstain from eating grapes?
    To be fair ephedrine does have addictive potential. Not that its a huge risk for most. But when my wife found out i was taking bronkaid she did some research (she is very cautious with anything i take considering my past) and found a TON of forum posts about people being addicted to bronkaid and couldnt stop taking it. Ephedrine is not meth though nor should it be treated like it

  8. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    Is caffeine not “speedy” or a “stimulant?” And do humans not build tolerance to it? So now addicts should abstain from caffeine? Just because ephedrine is used in meth doesn’t mean that their addictive potential is even remotely similar. It’s beyond fallacious logic. Grapes are used to make wine, should addicts abstain from eating grapes?
    I understand what you are saying. Addicts need to steer clear of anything they cannot injest or do in moderation. Any one thing not done in moderation very most often leads them back to their preferred addiction. For example, having a couple of cups of coffee a day is one thing - but taking 200mg tabs of caffiene throughout the day is another to an addict who is addicted to speed / cocaine. Its a slippery slope that results in way too many deaths. Its best to simply abstain from anything that cannot be done in moderation.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    Lol no. There’s mountains of research on ephedrine, and it is not a “gateway drug.” If ephedrine has to be converted into something while making meth, it’s not actually ephedrine that’s getting you high, so just taking ephedrine doesn’t carry any of that same risk.
    Ask anybody (like me) in the addiction community and they will tell you ephedrene is a gateway drug.

  10. Quote Originally Posted by bigsmall View Post
    I understand what you are saying. Addicts need to steer clear of anything they cannot injest or do in moderation. Any one thing not done in moderation very most often leads them back to their preferred addiction. For example, having a couple of cups of coffee a day is one thing - but taking 200mg tabs of caffiene throughout the day is another to an addict who is addicted to speed / cocaine. Its a slippery slope that results in way too many deaths. Its best to simply abstain from anything that cannot be done in moderation.
    Fair enough, but a key component of addiction is the detrimental effects of the addiction on the individual, and the people they associate with (from the family to society at large). Caffeine consumption, even in some level of excess, isn’t going to have nearly the same deleterious effects as actual drugs of abuse do, so even if an addict does end up having several hundred milligrams of caffeine a day, if that’s all they’re using, they’re still infinitely better off than before, as long as they don’t add more stuff in later and keep escalating.
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  11. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    Fair enough, but a key component of addiction is the detrimental effects of the addiction on the individual, and the people they associate with (from the family to society at large). Caffeine consumption, even in some level of excess, isn’t going to have nearly the same deleterious effects as actual drugs of abuse do, so even if an addict does end up having several hundred milligrams of caffeine a day, if that’s all they’re using, they’re still infinitely better off than before, as long as they don’t add more stuff in later and keep escalating.
    Absolutely this......

    Addicts can become addicted to many things, not all of them are detrimental.

    My coke and alcohol addiction nearly destroyed me and those around me.

    But

    I work in sales and am addicted to the endorphin release that comes from making a sale. That has given me a great income and the means to support my family in ways many aren’t fortunate too. I’m completely addicted to training and the chemical release from that, it’s going to probably add years to my life but crucially it will massively improve my quality of life as I get older. Now both those examples involve very similar chemical reactions in the brain as coke and e but no one would say it’s a bad thing.

    In my opinion it’s not the addictive nature of the relationship you have with anything, it’s the ability of that thing to harm you......

    I drink a lot of coffee (min 800mg caffeine a day, normally more) - honestly don’t believe I have any issues from it.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by muscleupcrohn View Post
    Is caffeine not “speedy” or a “stimulant?” And do humans not build tolerance to it? So now addicts should abstain from caffeine? Just because ephedrine is used in meth doesn’t mean that their addictive potential is even remotely similar. It’s beyond fallacious logic. Grapes are used to make wine, should addicts abstain from eating grapes?
    lol...try to find a AA meeting WITHOUT a coffee pot....just sayin
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  13. Thank you bro. Really appreciate it!

  14. Quote Originally Posted by Delboss731 View Post
    Thank you bro. Really appreciate it!
    a lot of people have offered advice, but what it comes down to is how bad do you want it!!!

    once a alky always a alky, even after 20 years of sobriety I am convinced that 1 drink will be my downfall....but for the grace of GOD there go I.
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