i am for phil

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    Edit: I'm not getting into a religious debate.

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    In 4 noods
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    End well this will not...
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    Sigh at many of these posts... Very well handled Josh. The suspension makes complete sense. It's quite obvious most in here have no clue. There is no violation of rights by a&e period only a violation of contract which led to consequences.
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    Phill just expressed his opinion, that's all...If you disagree with him, express yours...
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    This looks like a come to jesus meeting thread now. Why is it that there are so many versions of religious belief, even within the same denomination? These "rules" to live by have been written and re-written by people who want followers to believe there word is the way,and to act and do a certain way. If you want to take the bible word for word,and it gives you comfort,then more power to you. I think you are ignorant for following any book of rules that has been changed so many times just to fit the needs of others.
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    Being a Christian is fine (BTW, when did Christians start to act like they're such victims of discrimination), but using it as a veil for hate speech is not.

    If people want to shift it to a free speech issue, where was this kind of support for Reilly Cooper just a few months ago?
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    Quote Originally Posted by wicked442 View Post
    This looks like a come to jesus meeting thread now. Why is it that there are so many versions of religious belief, even within the same denomination? These "rules" to live by have been written and re-written by people who want followers to believe there word is the way,and to act and do a certain way. If you want to take the bible word for word,and it gives you comfort,then more power to you. I think you are ignorant for following any book of rules that has been changed so many times just to fit the needs of others.
    The bible was originally written in Hebrew, Aramaic and greek. A lot of letters, scripture and writings had to be TRANSLATED, reason for the rewriting of text. Some of the Greek letters we had no clue what it translated to. So, as more scholars pop up, study and find new meaning to these words, letters and symbols... Therefore text, again, is "re written" (actually re worded to be more accurate).

    Nobodies ignorant for there belief, you just do not know the history of the bible.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wicked442 View Post
    This looks like a come to jesus meeting thread now. Why is it that there are so many versions of religious belief, even within the same denomination? These "rules" to live by have been written and re-written by people who want followers to believe there word is the way,and to act and do a certain way. If you want to take the bible word for word,and it gives you comfort,then more power to you. I think you are ignorant for following any book of rules that has been changed so many times just to fit the needs of others.
    Wicked,

    Against my better judgement, I'll reply (and that is not a slight of you, more an admission that I am sure to get a lot of replies that I do not want to have to endure):

    1. It probably sounds like a religious revival for a few reasons. My issue is really limited to my personal dislike for selective re-interpretation of scripture. So, my response to the silly allegation that the OT and NT are to be equally valid in light of the New Covenant was to point out that someone does not know what they are talking about -- because that is simply not an accurate statement or allegation.
    2. Anyone can take a statement out of context and interpret or use it to conclude something that was never the intended meaning. I think it is OK to object to that, no different than if someone said you can inject test every day and it would have no impact on your HPTA. I take the Bible seriously; although I acknowledge other may not - and I accept that.
    3. My reply was not evangelism - but only a reply to something that was categorically incorrect.
    4. You are correct, there are denominations that have taken the inerrant Word of God and interpreted it in the modern context. Rather than call that Christianity, I believe it would be better labelled as Moral Relativism. For that very reason, I go to the most Bible based Church I can find. I do not want a bunch of silly mis-interpretations to take me away from the true essence of the Word.
    5. If Phil's comments would have been pro-homosexual, pro-abortion or pro-drug use, he would not have been put on hiatus. That is part of the issue, not that he can't have and espouse his opinions, but that only certain of those opinions will result in sanctions against the individual.

    As to Rodja's comment, I think we are on the cusp of finding ourselves in a society that is/will become hostile towards those that believe the Bible. Most have no idea where the concept of freedom of religion came from, nor do they understand that "freedom of" and "freedom from" are not the same.

    Some of that has happened, for instance in Canada - in which certain Biblical concepts may not be openly preached (in the church) because they are considered hate crimes.

    OK, I probably was stupid to take this up on this forum, but I do some stupid things every day.

    I do not wish to convert anyone on this forum, nor do I wish to "punish" anyone who does not share my views.

    Nonetheless, I feel a certain upset when people mis-interpret Biblical text, and not out of ignorance of that text, but with the intention of helping others draw an erroneous conclusion. My experience is that most who do so, have never regularly read the Bible, but somehow feel free to conclude what it says and means. If I flip open a few pages of a Chilton Auto Repair manual and read a few words, that alone does not make me qualified to diagnose engine problems.

    Lastly, as to the issue that Phil spoke about, every major religion in the world holds this same view on this same issue. For that reason, I do not understand the relevance of comparing Christianity vs other religious beliefs. Every religion denounces the behavior Phil spoke about. And note, Phil spoke as an individual, not as a theologian. Incidentally, some religions are FAR more drastic in their views on that behavior than Christianity.

    No more from me on this thread.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyga tyga View Post
    The bible was originally written in Hebrew, Aramaic and greek. A lot of letters, scripture and writings had to be TRANSLATED, reason for the rewriting of text. Some of the Greek letters we had no clue what it translated to. So, as more scholars pop up, study and find new meaning to these words, letters and symbols... Therefore text, again, is "re written" (actually re worded to be more accurate). Nobodies ignorant for there belief, you just do not know the history of the bible.
    If you live by how 1 person tells you to without question thats makes you very much a sheep. Imo. You cant tell me that not one person in history hasnt spoke "the word of god" just to make others believe and fall in line. There are so many religions and believes,but let me guess, yours is the right one. No offense personaly tyga.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wicked442 View Post
    If you live by how 1 person tells you to without question thats makes you very much a sheep.
    And, this is YOUR justification to how you live.
    You cant tell me that not one person in history hasnt spoke "the word of god" just to make others believe and fall in line. There are so many religions and believes,but let me guess, yours is the right one. No offense personaly tyga.
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    Is Pentecostal the "right denomination". Who am I to say? I go to my church to continue my relationship with The Lord, the fellowship and for accountability. Also, I believe in my pastors credentials and how he is lead to teach scripture.
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    So, this is how this conversation has turned? Personal jabs and spell check?
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimbuick View Post
    So, this is how this conversation has turned? Personal jabs and spell check?
    Does this upset you? You're infamous for doing this ^^ Instigating at its finest. My correction wasn't meant to disrespect wicked, did it for me. Just like his question, was of no offense to me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beau View Post
    As to Rodja's comment, I think we are on the cusp of finding ourselves in a society that is/will become hostile towards those that believe the Bible. Most have no idea where the concept of freedom of religion came from, nor do they understand that "freedom of" and "freedom from" are not the same.

    Some of that has happened, for instance in Canada - in which certain Biblical concepts may not be openly preached (in the church) because they are considered hate crimes.

    OK, I probably was stupid to take this up on this forum, but I do some stupid things every day.

    I do not wish to convert anyone on this forum, nor do I wish to "punish" anyone who does not share my views.

    Nonetheless, I feel a certain upset when people mis-interpret Biblical text, and not out of ignorance of that text, but with the intention of helping others draw an erroneous conclusion. My experience is that most who do so, have never regularly read the Bible, but somehow feel free to conclude what it says and means. If I flip open a few pages of a Chilton Auto Repair manual and read a few words, that alone does not make me qualified to diagnose engine problems.

    Lastly, as to the issue that Phil spoke about, every major religion in the world holds this same view on this same issue. For that reason, I do not understand the relevance of comparing Christianity vs other religious beliefs. Every religion denounces the behavior Phil spoke about. And note, Phil spoke as an individual, not as a theologian. Incidentally, some religions are FAR more drastic in their views on that behavior than Christianity.

    No more from me on this thread.
    I disagree with you position. It has nothing to do with those who believe in any sort of religious text; it has to do with those that justify their actions based upon a religious text especially considering all of the murders and heinous acts that have been carried out using God as their sole reasoning. We've finally hit a point in our society were someone can freely go against the grain without fearing the repercussions.

    Like I said, being religious is fine, but using it in any form as rationalization for bigotry is unacceptable.
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    Purple...
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    Red+blue?
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyga tyga View Post
    Red+blue?
    No, that's my go to derail when people take things a little too seriously.

    C'mon guys, everyone one knows political and religion threads always end badly...
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post
    No, that's my go to derail when people take things a little too seriously. C'mon guys, everyone one knows political and religion threads always end badly...
    And so does Eye Candy
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    What I dont understand is why only Phil's comments about being homosexual are the ones being pointed out. He pointed out that greed and sleeping around from person to person were a sin as well, but no ones got a problem with that all the attention goes to his gay comments. Did his comments directly effect the gay community somehow? Do I think it was right he got fired? No. Do I think his rights were violated? No. This is an argument that I honestly believe will never be settled because each side only wants to understand their own beliefs and point the finger at the other side saying "you're wrong for not believing what I do" the gay community wants their right to be gay to be recognized as much as the anti gay community wants their right to be anti gay accepted. Its a never ending cycle. I did think Phil's response to all this was somewhat humorous

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    We are getting off topic and I dont reeally want to get into a religious debate. From my experience it is always a dead end

    Instead lets get back on topic and try this

    Why shouldn't he have gotten suspended?

    Why shouldn't there be a public response to his beliefs?

    The foundation of his defense lies on those two beliefs. Please explain why you think he shouldnt have gotten suspended and why you think the public should ignore what he said.
    reasons he shouldn't have gotten suspended:
    1. they knew what his beliefs were and hired him anyways, his beliefs have not changed.
    2. duck dynasty is the number 1 rated show of all time on that network.
    3. the network owns the rights to duck dynasty merchandise, in total duck dynasty has made the network over $400 million....if the robertsons were to let their fans know that AandE is making the bulk of profit from duck dynasty merchandise then the same people who are going to boycott the network would probably stop buying the merchandise, a huge loss for the network.
    4. last but not least, it is totally bogus for AandE to announce that phil has been suspended...when 9 out of 10 episodes of the upcoming season have already been made and include phil in them.
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    ""You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving. For this people’s heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them. But blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear. For truly I tell you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see but did not see it, and to hear what you hear but did not hear it."

    "The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel that displays the glory of Christ, who is the image of God."

    Such confidence we have through Christ before God. Not that we are competent in ourselves to claim anything for ourselves, but our competence comes from God. He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

    You want to know who God is then read what Christ had to say. He is the New Covenant - the Old (covenant) Testament is no longer valid. So do not reference it.

    Homosexuality, adultery, murder, stealing, envy, gluteny are all sin and seperate us from God. Christ offers all of us sinners reconcilliation with God.

    When people who don't know the bible use the bible to invalidate the bible it is quite silly.

    Sadly most have no idea of what faith is because it is counter-intellectual and counter-logical/reasonable and therefore they reject it. Sadly far too many very intelligent people are victims of themselves. They have great intellectual capacity to define and metaphore what a paradox principle is yet are completely and hopelessly powerless to live by it.

    Inserting religion and mythology into a faith discussion is foolish. Discussing faith with someone who has no idea what faith is or how to practice it is equally foolish.

    "Do not deceive yourselves. If any of you think you are wise by the standards of this age, you should become fools so that you may become wise."

    I have absolutely the same proof you do. None. But "the substance of things hoped for by the evidence of the unseen" have been abundant in my life. "You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart." It does not say mind, logic, reason or any other faculty. All of those faculties contradict time after time after time. I cannot find Him on my terms.


    My God is a creator and nurturer - He created me perfectly and nurtures esteem just as your father should. Do you have a son or daughter whom your brought into the world whom you tell "you are my second or third most greatest". No. That would be counter instinctive and counter productive.


    Blaming sin for the absence of a God is naive.

    As far as alien life - my faith and knowledge of my God does not cause me to become ignorant nor do I dismiss that there may very well be other life in this vast universe that God created. Alien by definition means foreign. It does not mean that my same creator did not also create them and nurture them just as he has me.

    For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known."---All posts made by David Dunn


    If I may say few word on my own my friends God love Josh and others in here so we play the background and may be those do not see become blessed. Here is one Lecrae I think much in fitting for we shall always try to help with His help let us help truly

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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigt View Post
    reasons he shouldn't have gotten suspended:
    1. they knew what his beliefs were and hired him anyways, his beliefs have not changed.
    2. duck dynasty is the number 1 rated show of all time on that network.
    3. the network owns the rights to duck dynasty merchandise, in total duck dynasty has made the network over $400 million....if the robertsons were to let their fans know that AandE is making the bulk of profit from duck dynasty merchandise then the same people who are going to boycott the network would probably stop buying the merchandise, a huge loss for the network.
    4. last but not least, it is totally bogus for AandE to announce that phil has been suspended...when 9 out of 10 episodes of the upcoming season have already been made and include phil in them.
    in effect AandE is making a fortune off the robertsons while at the same time claiming to be outraged by them...
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    Dang @Touey, I thought you had lost your accent till I saw that most of your post was by DD and then saw that your accent was still there! Lol!
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    Hold on no SERM in pct? OMG next!!!!!!!!! Wait...wut?
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    I think the guy is a moron and anyone that believes crap like he does is too. But, he was within his right and no matter how dumb it makes him look, A+E knew exactly what they were getting so it is a bit hypocritical. I mean, we were raised Catholic and it wasn't until I learned the way religion views other's beliefs and how intolerant it is, that I realized what a crock of **** religion is. It's embarrassing to see what it can make otherwise intelligent people do and think.
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    No part of the Bible speaks of homosexuality as we know it today. I am a Christian and I believe the most important part of being a Christian is to learn of the circumstances the authors were facing when the books were composed. It was written in a specific time in history and under unique circumstances. The Bible in no way, shape, or form speaks of homosexuality as it pertains to today. In that time it was common practice for fathers to sodomize their youngest boy, then that boy did the same to his youngest son. Absolutely repulsive for todays standards. The word homosexuality did not even exist during that time. Paul, in Romans, was upset because Christians were using the temples as orgies, not because of the type of orgies that were occurring. It's not present in the Ten Commandments. Jesus never spoke of it. If it were such a terrible sin, don't you think the Son of Man, Jesus Christ himself would speak of it? The last time I read the four canonical Gospels, I'm pretty sure Jesus spoke of other sins. Not to mention it isn't present in the other non-canonical, "Gnostic", gospels.

    Main point: You have to read the scripture in the context of which it was written. The Bible is much more clandestine than most people realize.

    I cannot comprehend how a man could not love a woman, but thats how they were born. I find it very hypocritical that some Christians can condemn these people to hell and still look in the mirror everyday as if they're any better.

    Phil also had the right to speak his opinion without being chastised. Though the foundation of which differs from mine.

    Longest post of my career, I feel better now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CincyKiller45 View Post
    No part of the Bible speaks of homosexuality as we know it today. I am a Christian and I believe the most important part of being a Christian is to learn of the circumstances the authors were facing when the books were composed. It was written in a specific time in history and under unique circumstances. The Bible in no way, shape, or form speaks of homosexuality as it pertains to today. In that time it was common practice for fathers to sodomize their youngest boy, then that boy did the same to his youngest son. Absolutely repulsive for todays standards. The word homosexuality did not even exist during that time. Paul, in Romans, was upset because Christians were using the temples as orgies, not because of the type of orgies that were occurring. It's not present in the Ten Commandments. Jesus never spoke of it. If it were such a terrible sin, don't you think the Son of Man, Jesus Christ himself would speak of it? The last time I read the four canonical Gospels, I'm pretty sure Jesus spoke of other sins. Not to mention it isn't present in the other non-canonical, "Gnostic", gospels. Main point: You have to read the scripture in the context of which it was written. The Bible is much more clandestine than most people realize. I cannot comprehend how a man could not love a woman, but thats how they were born. I find it very hypocritical that some Christians can condemn these people to hell and still look in the mirror everyday as if they're any better. Phil also had the right to speak his opinion without being chastised. Though the foundation of which differs from mine. Longest post of my career, I feel better now.
    Jesus never mentioned homosexuality, but He did condemn all forms of sexual immorality:

    "What comes out of you is what defiles you. For from within, out of your hearts, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly. All these evils come from inside and defile you." (TNIV, Mark 7:20-23)

    Then we can talk about what Paul wrote,

    Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. (NIV, 1st Corinthians 6:9-11)

    Edit: I'm bowing out of this thread. Have a great holiday guys!
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    I have a rebuttal, but as noted before, I'm not looking to spark a debate. I don't believe you are either, judging from your post edit.

    I believe this passage in Micah sums up my learnings from the Hebrew Scriptures best: "He has told you, O mortal, what is good; and what does The Lord require of you but to do justice, and to love with kindness, and to walk humbly with your God" (The New Oxford Annotated Bible, Micah. 6:8 )?
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    Quote Originally Posted by CincyKiller45 View Post
    ...In that time it was common practice for fathers to sodomize their youngest boy, then that boy did the same to his youngest son...
    And you know that how? Or just pulled it out of your a$$? You never hear about it in islam or Judaism. They may have done it to their slaves or captured enemies, but not to their sons. Raping someone would be to show your utmost disrespect for the victim. That happens even now days in wars and conflicts...
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post

    The vast majority of public figure jobs have clauses such as this. Hell a majority of the jobs I have had they had it. But even if it wasnt in the contract then this is still not a freedom of speech issue. Freedom of speech protects you from legal prosecution. He faces no legal ramifications for what he said so there is no freedom of speech violation. People are confusing freedom of speech with the freedom to say whatever you want without ramifications for what was said from their peers or employers.
    If his contract did not have a clause for it then it is a legal issue not a freedom issue. Yes he has the freedom to say or believe whatever he wants but is not free from the consequences to what is said. He is only protected from government prosecuation and until he is thrown in jail for his beliefs then there is no freedom of speech violation.

    Not one jot or tittle of the law shall pass away until all is accomplished. That's what it is says in Mathew. The law isn't 10 commandments, it is 613. The law which says homosexuality is a sin calls for them to be killed for that sin and, with due respect, it calls for this guy to die because the products he is wearing on his show are made of mixed fibre.

    Its always fun watching people cherry pick scriptures
    You are taking Mosaic law out of context and Yes this would apply to a crowd of Jewish people however Jesus came to abolish Mosaic law. Does that mean homosexuality is OK? No because it is mentioned again post Mosaic law in the old testament. I love how people misinterpret the Bible. It's No longer a sin if I eat shellfish etc.

    Look at Peters vision of the feast in acts.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyga tyga View Post

    Old Testament. New Testament still condones homosexuality, when Christ was born, Old Testament fell to "the wayside" if you would. So, the mixed fibre deal.. Void. We eat shellfish, and things that crawl on the ground (snake, alligator..etcetera). We lust, but do we pull our eyes out or cut off our hand? No, we would remove ourself from the situation or block porn sites on the internet instead..

    Again, sin has no hierarchy sin is sin.

    ... Sorry for the rant...
    Had to get involved a little here. It didn't fall at all. In fact if you believe the story of Jesus he was an OT scholar and teacher. Couldn't have fallen.

    Damn, my neighbor didn't keep the Sabbath, anyone got any extra stones?
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    Quote Originally Posted by CincyKiller45 View Post
    No part of the Bible speaks of homosexuality as we know it today. I am a Christian and I believe the most important part of being a Christian is to learn of the circumstances the authors were facing when the books were composed. It was written in a specific time in history and under unique circumstances. The Bible in no way, shape, or form speaks of homosexuality as it pertains to today. In that time it was common practice for fathers to sodomize their youngest boy, then that boy did the same to his youngest son. Absolutely repulsive for todays standards. The word homosexuality did not even exist during that time. Paul, in Romans, was upset because Christians were using the temples as orgies, not because of the type of orgies that were occurring. It's not present in the Ten Commandments. Jesus never spoke of it. If it were such a terrible sin, don't you think the Son of Man, Jesus Christ himself would speak of it? The last time I read the four canonical Gospels, I'm pretty sure Jesus spoke of other sins. Not to mention it isn't present in the other non-canonical, "Gnostic", gospels.

    Main point: You have to read the scripture in the context of which it was written. The Bible is much more clandestine than most people realize.

    I cannot comprehend how a man could not love a woman, but thats how they were born. I find it very hypocritical that some Christians can condemn these people to hell and still look in the mirror everyday as if they're any better.

    Phil also had the right to speak his opinion without being chastised. Though the foundation of which differs from mine.

    Longest post of my career, I feel better now.
    Homosexuality is a sin, just like my sin of lust. You can't deny it. Luckily Jesus came to save us and intercede for us between us and God. The issues that needs yo be addressed is judgement and how we rebuke others. My sin is No different than the sin of homosexuality...both ultimately send Jesus to the cross. You are relying on your fallible interpretations of the Bible to promote want you want when Timothy clearly says all Scripture is God breathed and useful for teaching and instructing. If the Bible doesn't hold absolute truth then we may as well just dismiss it all together.
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    I promised to stay out.

    Thank you, fightback and tyga, for your replies.

    I should have never promised to stay out.

    There is so much misinformation propogated.

    Both OT and NT adress this specific issue, in detail.

    The relationship between the OT and the NT is clear as well, for anyone who has studied.

    The biblical position is clear. One needs only to look at the original terms used in the native language.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigt View Post
    about time someone had the balls to speak out against all the pc crap!!! GO PHIL
    AMEN!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beau View Post
    I promised to stay out.

    Thank you, fightback and tyga, for your replies.

    I should have never promised to stay out.

    There is so much misinformation propogated. Both OT and NT adress this specific issue, in detail.

    The relationship between the OT and the NT is clear as well, for anyone who has studied.

    The biblical position is clear. One needs only to look at the original terms used in the native language.
    Romans 1 clearly calls out relations between same genders.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    Sigh... the irrationally never ceases to amaze me A private company suspended an employee for expressing an opinion which that company felt represented them in a negative light. More than likely the guy signed a contract with A&E which had a clause that says he’s a representative of A&E and is expected to act accordingly. He violates the clause and A&E has a right to suspend him. What is really mind boggling is how people are making this a freedom of speech issue. A&E was justifiable in their actions and he really has no defense against them.
    Your right, its not a freedom of speech issue; but it is border line freedom of religion issue. If my employer heard that I went to a evangelical church and heard me say something that was not politically correct, can he fire me?

    In that case maybe a Christian boss can fire a Jewish Muslim employee for saying something bad about Jesus?

    Also, it iis a capitalist issue. If the viewers, who are mostly not gays, stop watching, ratings go down and sponsors no longer want to advertise becuz of no viewership, than it would behoove them to put him back.

    Also, funny how its ok to fire Phil but a Christian baker is forced to bake cakes for gays?
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    JudoJosh is exactly right in this. He couldn't have explained it any clearer!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by fightbackhxc View Post
    Romans 1 clearly calls out relations between same genders.
    Agreed.

    You would have to try, as many do, to claim this is not directly and specifically addressed.

    If people want to reject the validity of the Bible, they can.

    If people want to disagree with what the Bible says, they can.

    If people want to believe there is no God, or that there are many gods, they can.

    But to claim the Bible does not specifically address this issue is both innacurate and misleading.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beau
    But to claim the Bible does not specifically address this issue is both innacurate and misleading.
    With respect:

    No one claimed that there isn't a few books/letters in the Bible that speak of this in some sense. Context, and when you look at it again, remember context.

    You cannot read the Bible in black-and-white. If I were to have that view than I would believe slavery is a "natural condition". Because St. Paul said in the New Testament, "slaves be obedient to your masters".

    I am not claiming the Bible does condone slavery, but the act of picking specific phrases to prove that homosexuality is wrong can also be used to argue that slavery is right.

    To focus on certain phrases, ignoring the meta-themes of justice, forgiveness and love in the Bible is just an example of not seeing the forest for the trees and in my opinion a perversion of the original message.

    Last post here. Happy holidays fellow meatheads.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CincyKiller45 View Post
    With respect: No one claimed that there isn't a few books/letters in the Bible that speak of this in some sense. Context, and when you look at it again, remember context. You cannot read the Bible in black-and-white. If I were to have that view than I would believe slavery is a "natural condition". Because St. Paul said in the New Testament, "slaves be obedient to your masters". I am not claiming the Bible does condone slavery, but the act of picking specific phrases to prove that homosexuality is wrong can also be used to argue that slavery is right. To focus on certain phrases, ignoring the meta-themes of justice, forgiveness and love in the Bible is just an example of not seeing the forest for the trees and in my opinion a perversion of the original message. Last post here. Happy holidays fellow meatheads.
    I dont think anyone has to pick and chose verses out of the Bible to prove its a sin. Its obvious and plane that it is. And no one is saying we shouldnt love and forgive; but condoning and encouraging an abomination is not love.
  

  
 

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