- 11-06-2012, 08:55 PM
- 11-06-2012, 09:01 PM
I assume u are talking about the alpha bulk and alpha mass by forerunner? And no. They arent. Theyre far weaker and less effective. They sure are riding the coattails of the androseries tho.
- 11-06-2012, 09:09 PM
similar, yes. but very diffent
alpha mass = 1-dhea
alpha bulk = 4-dhea
i may be wring on andro series here, but i believe it was
andromass = 4-dhea, androsterone, epiandrosterone
androbulk = 4-dhea, nordhea
11-06-2012, 09:36 PM
Right? Similar names labels everything. Bummed.
11-06-2012, 09:50 PM
TOO similar. Looks like primordial made them even. Very sneaky. But thats supps for ya.Originally Posted by digitalducki
11-06-2012, 09:54 PM
If prefer they just cloned the PRODUCT not the labels lol
11-07-2012, 07:20 AM
11-07-2012, 09:55 AM
Company sponsored logs? Yeah im sure they are. They arent just as effective. My rough estimate is about half. Maybe a little more than half. But not much.Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd
11-07-2012, 11:46 AM
11-07-2012, 12:41 PM
I have personaly run both products from both companies and while they were both effective, i felt FRL was able to make products that were just as strong and half the price.
Just my opinion though.
E-Pharm Rep... PM me with any questions or concerns
11-07-2012, 01:36 PM
Lets agree to disagree and quit trying to be aggressive just to take up for your company. Im well aware of how this works. They pay you, of course youre going to say their products are just as good. Jay cutler says "this is what i take" as he holds a bottle of build hd (crappy creatine product)... I guess im suppose to beleive him too huh?Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd
11-07-2012, 03:11 PM
11-07-2012, 04:22 PM
Youre the ONLY person replying like this. Wonder why? Im sure it has nothing to do with u being a rep. And btw. I didnt really say they suck. They dont suck. But. Youre lying to yourself and you know it if you think they hold a candle to the androseries. Where is the FDA raiding you guys at ??? Primordial got raided because they work that good and FDA expects foul play. They would be doing the same to you if your stuff worked as well as primordials.Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd
11-07-2012, 04:35 PM
I liked primordial and believe that they truly wanted to do good, but to say that the FDA raided them because they were that much better is nonsense. They got raided because of their advertising and that they compared the androseries to actual injectable testosterone.
E-Pharm Rep... PM me with any questions or concerns
11-07-2012, 04:41 PM
actually, people just arnt responding to your babling becuase its ****in stupid. the reasonn pp got raided was because they compared their substances to injectable test on their advertising, call their products dshea legal steroids, and they say that pp's products are overdosed to dangerous levelsOriginally Posted by grandroid828
11-07-2012, 06:08 PM
well this thread went south pretty quick, but to the OP, yes the products are very similar whereas the PP products were usually a combination of different compounds, the FRL items are focused on 1 compound.. Alpha Mass= Ultra 1-dhea, Alpha Bulk= Ultra 4-dhea, 5-alpha test= epiandrosterone.. Andromass v2 was made up of 1-dhea and 4-dhea, the 1-dhea was removed and replaced with epiandrosterone in andromass v3 I believe. I like the FRL line and how you can control ur dosing on each of the compounds is quite convenient.
11-07-2012, 06:09 PM
11-07-2012, 06:11 PM
Btw I was a primary member of the formulation team for all FRL products. So to say I believe in them just because I get a paycheck is nonsense. I believe in them because we worked our ass off to put the best product possible on the market.
11-07-2012, 06:18 PM
Have you read any FRL or AMS logs...? Looks like the work to me.Originally Posted by grandroid828
And I'm not just saying that cuz I like these guys.
I ran FRL and AMS stuff before...
11-07-2012, 06:19 PM
How is he being aggressive? You came into an FRL sub forum attacking the product. He reps them cuz he knows they work.Originally Posted by grandroid828
He defends their name because THESE PRODUCTS WORK.
Maybe you should aggressively leave.
11-07-2012, 07:19 PM
I didnt attack? Did you read my post. Im entitled to the opinion that they "are far lest effective" than primordial. Is that an attack to you? No. He attacked me insulting me saying i dont know what im talking about. Pretty sure forum rules dont say anything about me not being able to state my opinion in a non hostile or offensive way.Originally Posted by FL3X MAGNUM
11-07-2012, 07:28 PM
I never said you broke the rule. I was rather implying that you are speaking objectively and seeing how you have no first hand experience I'm guessing, your opinion doesn't matter here.Originally Posted by grandroid828
11-07-2012, 07:35 PM
11-07-2012, 07:37 PM
My questions to FRL:
Alphabulk has 120mg of 4-DHEA
Andromass had 500mg 4-DHEA(+550mg androsterone)
What is to make me believe that Alpha bulk does not need to be mega dosed to get the same effect as Andromass?
11-07-2012, 07:48 PM
11-07-2012, 07:49 PM
My question to you is what makes you believe that the high dose of 4-DHEA in Andromass was necessary?Originally Posted by Ape McGrapes
I've ran both compounds, and saw similar gains.
If you truly want to "mega dose" go ahead. It'll cost about the same in the end anyways.......
11-07-2012, 08:49 PM
Just because a 1lb tub of whey cost less than a 5lb tub, doesn't make it better than or equal too.
Flex, where is the research that 4-dhea has a point of deminishing returns? I'm not calling you a liar on your results, but it just doesn't add up to me. 4-DHEA requires a 2 step conversion process to become androstenedione/androstenediol and then ultimately testosterone. Adrostenedione(4-AD) had to be dosed 1000mg-3000mg orally and only took 1 step to convert. Hormone carriers aside; why am I to belive 120mg is enough?
I'm not saying you don't have a good product, but on paper it seems underdosed, and when dosed higher equates to a similar price. Only problem is you would need to take a **** ton of pills.
11-07-2012, 08:51 PM
11-07-2012, 08:53 PM
11-07-2012, 08:56 PM
11-07-2012, 08:59 PM
this evidence that the two step 1-DHEA's/4-DHEA's are more efficiently converting to diols. Not diones. Our entire basis for dosing can be found at the following:
11-07-2012, 09:02 PM
Thank you. I will be back in here later, after I read them.
11-07-2012, 09:04 PM
11-07-2012, 09:35 PM
That wasn't a smart remark, he spelled something wrong.Originally Posted by 3clipseGT
11-07-2012, 09:47 PM
11-08-2012, 04:42 AM
"They would be doing the same to you if your stuff worked as well as primodials" - - - Another ignorant statement at best. You could not even begin to deduce rhyme or reasoning of the FDA and how they work. What about all of the other companies, big and small, that sell products that work as well or are stronger? What about the companies that the FDA went after for Superdrol 5+ years after they stopped selling the product? It is awfully grandiose of you to think you know how this business works.
Reading your posts I equate to watching those slapstick type comedy movies where the character has no sense of self embarrassment that the movie watcher actually begins to feel embarrassed for them.
ADVANCED MUSCLE SCIENCE
Strongest On The Market
RECOVERBRO: Est. Post #3222
11-09-2012, 06:39 AM
Guys, I'm studying the FDA and drug products liability course in law school right now, if PPs products are not illegal, the issue is the labeling and product claims not the actual product itself, I can't say exactly why they were raided, but based on available federal case law surrounding supplements, which YES the FDA has the power to regulate, I think the FDA will rule the PPs products are misbranded and are actually drugs not supplements, and therefore to be marketed they need to submit a pre-market approval through the FDA to be an actual drug, that would cost millions
The FDA can say a supplement is an actual drug if they want, especially with the claims a manufacturer makes and the effects it has on your body
But what I believe happened here, is that some other force is in play, unless there are massive amounts of filed complaints to the FDA about a supplement being dangerous etc, usually the FDA won't act unless they are persuaded by someone like a pharmaceutical company, or politicians that are lobbied by those companies, it could be that someone is testing and spending millions on PPs technology with oral non-methylated hormones
PP is a small fish to fry, the FDA is very small a actually and has very little time and resources to waste, I'm 95% sure there is a much bigger underlying reason other than the new laws coming out, because its much easier and the FDA would rather send an opinion letter to PP if it were their own internal reasons, trust me they don't care about most supplements, not the least bit
11-09-2012, 07:12 PM
I ran bulk and mass and felt they were more effective than the primordial products. I recovered faster and gained more strength . I also had plenty of left over cash for staple supplements .
11-10-2012, 05:24 PM
11-10-2012, 05:47 PM
All those article really did was explain your hormone carrier, and to show that you propose that you get upto 70% bioavailability with it.
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