Best ways to train side delts for size

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    Best ways to train side delts for size


    What are some ways to build side delts for size ?

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    Standing overhead press supersetted with side laterals. 6-10 reps on the OHP and 12-15 on SL.
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    Thanks alot
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    i use military press and cable raises, 6-8 mp, 10-12 side raises
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    21's w/ side lateral raises
    7 low raises (waist area to under chest area)
    7 high raises (chest area and higher)
    7 full range raises
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    not that i have huge shoulders but how about an upright row with constant tension kept on the side delt.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Docmattic View Post
    not that i have huge shoulders but how about an upright row with constant tension kept on the side delt.
    and it will also hurt your rotator cuff muscles. the upright row is horrible. just like behind the neck presses/pulldowns.
    you can call me "ozzie" for short.
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    Quote Originally Posted by asooneyeonig View Post
    and it will also hurt your rotator cuff muscles. the upright row is horrible. just like behind the neck presses/pulldowns.
    It's not that bad if you use a wide grip and only go up to your sternum/when your upper arms are parallel to the floor.

    Whenever I do isolation work for side delts, I like doing double pyramid sets. So for instance, you would do something like 15lbs for 12 reps, 20lbs for 10 reps, 25lbs for 8 reps, and 30 for 6 reps, with 30-45 seconds between each instance. After the 6 rep set, you would take like a 1-2 minute break, then reset back down to 15 and do the pyramid set all over again. If that gets easy, up the starting weight by 5lbs (2.5lbs would honestly be more optimal if you have that option).
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    Yes, lower sternum. But most people row up to their chins...which mimics the movement physical therapists use to test for supraspinatus impingement - smart, really smart.

    Br
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    I used cables to do upright rows with rope or seperate handles. It reduced the stress on my shoulders due to the flexibility of hand position. I don't do it often though, right now doing two sets of side lats then do two sets partials with heavier weights. We'll see if that makes a difference.

    I need to work on my read lats, which bent over DB rows with arms to the sides seem to target them well and the side lats as described. But again, time will tell if they are working.

    I have an inherent weakness that I cannot seem to overcome. I cannot maintain strength from set to set and strength drops drastically between sets so I try to get the most out of my first and second sets. For example, I can do 10 reps with couple of reps in the tank, rest 90 seconds, second set I may or may not get 10 reps, rest 90, third set I would hardly get 5-6 reps. Also when I deload, strength goes down and it is a struggle to rebuild it back up.
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    I have an inherent weakness that I cannot seem to overcome. I cannot maintain strength from set to set and strength drops drastically between sets so I try to get the most out of my first and second sets. For example, I can do 10 reps with couple of reps in the tank, rest 90 seconds, second set I may or may not get 10 reps, rest 90, third set I would hardly get 5-6 reps. Also when I deload, strength goes down and it is a struggle to rebuild it back up.[/QUOTE]

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    Quote Originally Posted by fadi View Post

    I have an inherent weakness that I cannot seem to overcome. I cannot maintain strength from set to set and strength drops drastically between sets so I try to get the most out of my first and second sets. For example, I can do 10 reps with couple of reps in the tank, rest 90 seconds, second set I may or may not get 10 reps, rest 90, third set I would hardly get 5-6 reps. Also when I deload, strength goes down and it is a struggle to rebuild it back up.
    first cool to see your from san antonio, im in austin. But if i could give you some advice, if your going for hypertophy or strength i dont understand starting with a weight you can do more than ten times and ending on that same weight? you should pyramid up, or start initially with a heavier weight.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED View Post
    Yes, lower sternum. But most people row up to their chins...which mimics the movement physical therapists use to test for supraspinatus impingement - smart, really smart.

    Br
    I dont know how people go to their chins....yes sternum or nipples is about as far as i can go without the movement feeling dangerous. I find it quite effective to go wide grip upright rows with a barbell follwed by a close grip dropset using a plate (if the plates have handles designed into them.)
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    Quote Originally Posted by asooneyeonig View Post
    and it will also hurt your rotator cuff muscles. the upright row is horrible. just like behind the neck presses/pulldowns.
    Yes it can be bad but usually is due to bad form/too much weight,
    but yes, even with good form and everything it can be risky.

    A great alternative is to do one arm DB upright rows, very effective exercise.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny1011 View Post
    first cool to see your from san antonio, im in austin. But if i could give you some advice, if your going for hypertophy or strength i dont understand starting with a weight you can do more than ten times and ending on that same weight? you should pyramid up, or start initially with a heavier weight.
    I've done that. I used to pyramid down but now trying new approach for few weeks.
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    BB shoulder press followed by side laterals as others have stated. My side delts are deff a strong point give you a much larger appearance because you look wider on top (helps with a small waist also all about that illusion of proportions lol)..now if only my REAR delts would follow suit
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    Quote Originally Posted by AutoKal47 View Post
    Yes it can be bad but usually is due to bad form/too much weight,
    but yes, even with good form and everything it can be risky.

    A great alternative is to do one arm DB upright rows, very effective exercise.
    Not as much external rotation, but you're still going to cause impingement and un-needed wear bringing the dumbbells as high as that guy was in the video.

    Br
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED View Post
    Not as much external rotation, but you're still going to cause impingement and un-needed wear bringing the dumbbells as high as that guy was in the video.

    Br
    Agree, he brings it way too high, I forgot to mention that.
    I like this exercise a lot and I do it regularly in my shoulder routine but I don't
    bring it up that high
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    A big problem with training the middle delt is keeping the tension there and avoiding trap take over. Lateral cable or db will do that. DB or BB shoulder presses engage core, neck, traps and so on so isolation isn't great there either. The hammer strength shoulder machine is the best tool I have ever used for building the delts. It really keeps a lot of the focus on the delts. I believe shoulders need to be trained differently than other muscles as well. They are mainly stabilizers so they should be trained in that way. Doing long negative reps or holds at the top of the reps have drastically developed my shoulders over the years. Also going heavy has never led to any positive results. Keep the weights light. Doing a lot of reps, long holds and negatives.

    My example shoulder routine is

    Hammer strength 25lbs 3-5 second holds at top, don't completely lock out, slow negatives down 3-5 seconds, than hold at bottom for 3-5 seconds. I do this for 12-15 reps. 3 sets.

    Bent over rear flys with DB's 5-10lbs 15-20 reps. 3 sets

    Band external rotations. 15-30 reps. 2-3 sets.

    Notice how my routine is more focused on shoulder stabilization. I don't even work front delts directly. They get plenty of stabilization work through push-ups as they are always in my routine.

    This routine keeps my shoulders growing and I've never seen any plateus. The key is to go up in weights, reps, very slowly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by VS91588
    21's w/ side lateral raises
    7 low raises (waist area to under chest area)
    7 high raises (chest area and higher)
    7 full range raises
    ^^^ THIS ^^^
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    I really like Arnold presses (I'd post a link but I'm on my phone)

    You could kind of say its half dumbbells press half lateral raise. My opinion is its great but I'd like to hear what others think aswell.
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    I read somewhere that majority of bodybuilders have over developed front delts about 70% larger than the side and rear that's why a lot of times when people look at the mirror from the front looks like they have a fully developed delts but in reality it's all front delts barely side and rear is flat. So by training I only do one press( military press) & do my side laterals like with pinky higher than my thumb like pouring a bottle
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    Cause still side laterals done incorrectly will likely overstimulate front delts, every time I want to concentrate on my side delts I do my laterals on an incline bench sideways 1 hand at a time with pinky higher than my thumb. I don't do front raises because front delts already gets stimulated on chest days and shoulder press exercises
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strygwyr View Post
    ....& do my side laterals like with pinky higher than my thumb like pouring a bottle
    ouch! sounds painful. you are hammering your bones against each other while doing that. if you want to hit the sides drop your elbows, point your thumbs up and lean forward. your front will still get hit, but you will not damage your shoulders in the process.
    you can call me "ozzie" for short.
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    Lol I don't over do it I know what your talking about and yeah it hurts. if you have time search Charles glass style side laterals on you tube the db barely goes all the way up so you really have to be in control of the movement and I use medium to light weight and I don't drop it all the way on the bottom since delts are mid range exercises and benefit a lot from time under tension. Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems to be working for me lately
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    http://youtu.be/Hm7GIcy0sAQ

    this is one of my fav exercises for rear delts, then behind the back lateral raises (cable)
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    Quote Originally Posted by asooneyeonig View Post
    ouch! sounds painful. you are hammering your bones against each other while doing that. if you want to hit the sides drop your elbows, point your thumbs up and lean forward. your front will still get hit, but you will not damage your shoulders in the process.
    As someone with shoulder issues, I have NEVER even sensed ANY level of friction/discomfort/etc doing what stryg does. Dropping elbows AND pointing thumbs up will not target lateral delts, and may remove them. The exception is if you are leaning over on a bench parallel to the floor.
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    If you are going to maintain a high degree of external rotation as Styrg is describing, than you shouldn't bring the weight above your lower chest level. The higher you go the greater the impingement of the supraspinatus will be.

    And yes, most bodybuilders have over developed front deltoids due to all the shoulder flexion and scapula protraction work, and an inadequate amount of shoulder extension and scapula retraction work.

    Br
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torobestia View Post
    As someone with shoulder issues, I have NEVER even sensed ANY level of friction/discomfort/etc doing what stryg does. Dropping elbows AND pointing thumbs up will not target lateral delts, and may remove them. The exception is if you are leaning over on a bench parallel to the floor.
    i see doing side raises that way just like upright rows, behind the neck anything, and leg presses. many people do them. some have no issues at all but there is too great of a chance of injury so i still wont do them. there are safer exercises that will still get me the same if not better results. many people disagree with me on that but i still wont do them and i will still get stronger and bigger.
    you can call me "ozzie" for short.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strygwyr View Post
    I read somewhere that majority of bodybuilders have over developed front delts
    This is true, often because they get so much front delt work on chest exercises, neglect the rotator cuff complex and rear delts. Adding more front delt work will only cause further imbalance in the shoulders and rotate them foward. You end up having forward shoulders and poor posture. I'am a big fan of working the "rear" much more than the front of the body. Gravity is always bringing us down and forward so we need to build up strength in the muscles that keep us upright. When the shoulder are aligned properly the chest looks much bigger, it's more flexible and able to push more weight. Guys obsess about a big chest but don't realize what they think will make it look bigger is actually making it look smaller.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flaw

    This is true, often because they get so much front delt work on chest exercises, neglect the rotator cuff complex and rear delts. Adding more front delt work will only cause further imbalance in the shoulders and rotate them foward. You end up having forward shoulders and poor posture. I'am a big fan of working the "rear" much more than the front of the body. Gravity is always bringing us down and forward so we need to build up strength in the muscles that keep us upright. When the shoulder are aligned properly the chest looks much bigger, it's more flexible and able to push more weight. Guys obsess about a big chest but don't realize what they think will make it look bigger is actually making it look smaller.
    Well said. Straighter, bigger back equals bigger chest, bigger tri's equal bigger arms... From an aesthetic outlook
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    Pre-exhaust a heavy pushing exercise with some light, high rep laterals, then do the rest of your shoulder workout, then do this:

    Delt Triad

    Pick a weight you can do 15 laterals with.

    Do 12 laterals, immediately followed by 12 front raises, followed again by 12 shoulder presses, all with the original weight.

    Rest 30 seconds and repeat.

    Do 3 sets. It brings on a brutal pump and really rounds out the muscle when you pose.
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    Quote Originally Posted by asooneyeonig View Post
    and it will also hurt your rotator cuff muscles. the upright row is horrible. just like behind the neck presses/pulldowns.
    I would agree with that
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED
    Yes, lower sternum. But most people row up to their chins...which mimics the movement physical therapists use to test for supraspinatus impingement - smart, really smart.

    Br
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED
    Yes, lower sternum. But most people row up to their chins...which mimics the movement physical therapists use to test for supraspinatus impingement - smart, really smart.

    Br
    Speaking of the supraspinatus, what would be the best course of action for impingement? I've been thinking recently that I may have an impingement or be flirting close to it.
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    First course would be to run some simple tests to try and determine which tendon is impinged..whether its the SS, IS, or biceps tendon. From there, some ice/anti inflammatories and corrective exercises can be used.
  

  
 

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