Another Epistane Cycle Critique Request

[2skinny]

Hello everyone! This is my first post so hopefully I won’t make a complete arse of myself. I’ll get right into it.
Height : 6’1
Weight: 179
Age: 27
My goal is to put on about 20lbs of lean body mass. I realize that this will take some time but right now time is what I have…and also a little cash.
I have been lifting for about 5 years now. I would consider myself an ectomorph. I have tried many different training splits but currently I am using a 3 on, 1 off, repeat.
Day 1 Chest & Bis
Day 2 Legs & Shoulders
Day 3 Back & Tris
Day 4 Rest
I try work my abs, calfs and forearms EOD as well. I also do some kind of cardio 3 or 4 times per week. I realize cardio hinders me from putting on weight but I am willing to sacrifice a little weight for endurance. I keep my workouts to no more than an hour. Sometimes I will have a chance to hit the gym twice in one day so I will split my workout to two 45 min sessions.
As far as nutrition goes, currently I am only supplementing protein, BCAAs, a multi, and fish oil. I am eating about 7 times a day including pre/post workout shakes, whole meals and snacking. My diet is not all that clean right now because I am eating my 3 main meals a day from a military dining facility. I eat what they give me, but me being an ectomorph, this is not a big concern of mine. I eat till I’m full and then I usually try and cram a little more.
I’ve put on weight in the past, at one point up to 189. Of course to do this I was experimenting with 1-AD then M1T and Tren all very very foolishly. I had no knowledge whatsoever of post cycle therapy, supporting supps or even proper dosing. I just threw in a little 6-OXO and called it good. I did see quick strength gains with these but I also saw quick losses and some sides like gyno and hair loss. :sad: While using creatine I was able to get up to 184 but lost it all when I went on vacation for a month. I can easily lose 3 months of hard work on a month’s vacation. Lame!
I’ve been researching Epistane quite a bit lately and I also have a friend who put on about 15 pounds from it (not all lean but looks good). I am excited to try a cycle myself. Before I jump into a cycle this time though, I want to make sure I experience minimal sides, make quality gains and keep these gains. Here’s what I’ve come up with:
Epistane – 6 weeks straight cycle (30/40/40/40/40/40)
Supporting Supps – AI Cycle Support, Fish oil, Multi, Cissus
PCT – Torem (120/80/40/20), Retain2, Hyperdrol X2, Max FX, AI Post Cycle Support, Powerfull
One problem I am having is getting a hold of some Torem. I can get Nolva but Torem seems to be the way to go for this type of cycle…at least from what I’ve seen here on this forum.
So there is just a rough plan for this cycle. I hoping for suggestions/comments. I realize there are many Epistane threads on this board and yes, this is another one. I am willing to post my progress once I get going, hoping that it will help another newbie like myself. Ha Ha! Thanks.

I'm also trying to attach a couple pictures for all to get a better idea of what I'm working with.

 

[crader]

We can never have to many encouragement threads...good luck!

 

[2skinny]

Thanks Crader!

 

[2skinny]

So here it is:

1 week pre cycle: Anabolic Innovation's Cycle Support and other misc supporting supps.
Week 1 - Epistane 30mg, AI Cycle Support, Cissus,
Week 2 - Epistane 40mg, AI Cycle Support, Cissus,
Week 3 - Epistane 50mg, AI Cycle Support, Cissus,
Week 4 - Epistane 50mg, AI Cycle Support, Cissus,
Week 5 - Epistane 40mg, AI Cycle Support, Cissus,
Week 6 - Epistane 40mg, AI Cycle Support, Cissus,
Week 7 - Torem 120mg (2days) 90mg(5days), AI Post Cycle Support, AX Hyperdrol X2, AX MassFX, AX Retain2, USPlabs Powerfull
Week 8 - Torem 75mg(5days) 60mg(2days), AI Post Cycle Support, AX Hyperdrol X2, AX MassFX, AX Retain2, USPlabs Powerfull
Week 9 - Torem 60mg(3days) 30mg(4days), AI Post Cycle Support, AX Hyperdrol X2, AX MassFX, AX Retain2, USPlabs Powerfull
Week 10 - Torem 30mg(till gone), AI Post Cycle Support, AX Hyperdrol X2, AX MassFX, AX Retain2, USPlabs Powerfull

Questions:
1. Does anyone see any possible problems with going up tp 50mg Epistane?
2. Is my post cycle therapy overkill or redundant since I've included Powerfull?
3. Did I forget anything?

I'm ready to purchase these items except fot the fact that I can't get my hands on Torem. I will not start this cycle without. I will keep searching.
Feel free to tear this cycle of mine apart if you think it's trash but I am also open to constructive suggestions. Thanks guys!

 

[neoborn]

I think your cycle looks great. Good job.

If you were to get Innovative with your Research on the Net I am sure you will be able to find something suitable to your needs.

Much Love,

Neoborn

 

[CROWLER]

Looks VERY well thought out.

It looks like you will need 2 jars of Cycle Support and 1 bottle of POST Cycle Support.

We have a special going that if you email the receipt to us we give you a $5 rebate via Pay Pal. Just send it directly to me at [email protected]

We verify the order with the store and get your rebate out to you right away. Please include your name and address from the order confirmation.

Thank you,


CROWLER

 

[2skinny]

I think your cycle looks great. Good job.

If you were to get Innovative with your Research on the Net I am sure you will be able to find something suitable to your needs.

Much Love,

Neoborn

Neoborn, thanks for looking over my proposed cycle. I really appreciate your advice. It seems what I'm looking for is backordered though. I will have to find other means or just stand by. Thanks again!

 

[2skinny]

Looks VERY well thought out.

It looks like you will need 2 jars of Cycle Support and 1 bottle of POST Cycle Support.

We have a special going that if you email the receipt to us we give you a $5 rebate via Pay Pal. Just send it directly to me at [email protected]

We verify the order with the store and get your rebate out to you right away. Please include your name and address from the order confirmation.

Thank you,


CROWLER

Crowler, thank you! I might be taking you up on that offer very soon....well as long as I can work out a few other kinks.

 

[milwood]

2skinny-
I'd like to commend you as well for obviously taking great consideration in planning your run, and also for throwing it out here for feedback. The more feedback you get, the more you'll learn. To me, it looks nice. I haven't reun Epistane yet, so I don't know about dosing, but I suggest you feel your way through that.That is, 50mg may be overkill, or it may not. See how it goes during your first weeks and go from there. If you're still seeing gains at 30 and 40, I'd stay, because more isn't always better as you know.

As far as the post-cycle, seems nice. I like the Powerfull in there, and I like to run lots of stuff post-cycle to help me keep gains and bounce back (I'm an ecto and its a b*tch trying to keep gains sometimes!)

Good work and keep posting!

 

[2skinny]

2skinny-
I'd like to commend you as well for obviously taking great consideration in planning your run, and also for throwing it out here for feedback. The more feedback you get, the more you'll learn. To me, it looks nice. I haven't reun Epistane yet, so I don't know about dosing, but I suggest you feel your way through that.That is, 50mg may be overkill, or it may not. See how it goes during your first weeks and go from there. If you're still seeing gains at 30 and 40, I'd stay, because more isn't always better as you know.

As far as the post-cycle, seems nice. I like the Powerfull in there, and I like to run lots of stuff post-cycle to help me keep gains and bounce back (I'm an ecto and its a b*tch trying to keep gains sometimes!)

Good work and keep posting!

Milwood...WOW...great advice and very encouraging! Thanks a million and I will do my best to post my progress once I get up and running.

 

[Wilderbeast]

This would be kind of a personal preference type thing, but to be honest I don't think you really need torem in post cycle if that's what's stopping you at this point from running your cycle. Epistane is supposed to be somewhat anti-estrogenic on its own. If that is the only hormone you plan on running a mild, but sufficient, post cycle is all that would theoretically be needed. You might try some ATD along with 6-oxo. I'm not a big fan of 6oxo myself, the Neogenix PCT stack would be more than sufficent for your cycle tho (Regenesen, Supremacy, Amplitude). You probably wouldn't even really need the Amplitude. Just my opinion. Hope I helped!

 

[mountainboy]

2skinny, my compliments as well on a well thought out cycle- a couple suggestions though- you may want to purchase taurine for back/calf pumps (the calf pumps I am experiencing right now are a pain- I am on 40mg epi/ED taking 4 grams taurine, as well as creatine and still getting the calf pumps) and for post cycle, I believe you would be fine with dermacrine sustain for a SERM.

A couple questions for you- I like the way your split looks, can you post your routine (sets,reps), and what excersises do you do for your traps in particular (been trying to build mine up)

 

[2skinny]

This would be kind of a personal preference type thing, but to be honest I don't think you really need torem in post cycle if that's what's stopping you at this point from running your cycle. Epistane is supposed to be somewhat anti-estrogenic on its own. If that is the only hormone you plan on running a mild, but sufficient, post cycle is all that would theoretically be needed. You might try some ATD along with 6-oxo. I'm not a big fan of 6oxo myself, the Neogenix post cycle therapy stack would be more than sufficent for your cycle tho (Regenesen, Supremacy, Amplitude). You probably wouldn't even really need the Amplitude. Just my opinion. Hope I helped!

Thank you Wilderbeast. Your advice is a big help to me because it is causing me to look a little harder at my PCT and research possible alternates. I am definately tempted to get on with this cycle without Torem but I haven't given up yet. I realize Epistane is realtively mild and does have SERM like effects in itself but I am trying to be very thorough and cautious with my PCT. I am going to start doing my research on ATD w/ 6oxo and Neogenix pct stack today. Thanks again!

 

[2skinny]

2skinny, my compliments as well on a well thought out cycle- a couple suggestions though- you may want to purchase taurine for back/calf pumps (the calf pumps I am experiencing right now are a pain- I am on 40mg epi/ED taking 4 grams taurine, as well as creatine and still getting the calf pumps) and for post cycle, I believe you would be fine with dermacrine sustain for a SERM.

A couple questions for you- I like the way your split looks, can you post your routine (sets,reps), and what excersises do you do for your traps in particular (been trying to build mine up)

Yeah it sounds like some taurine wouldn't be a bad idea. And dermacrine sustain for a SERM...I will definately look into that. I'm really appreciate you guys thowing ideas/suggestions around. It's makes me realize how little I really do know about all this stuff and causes me to use the search feature a little more often.

As far as my workout routine goes....I'll take some stuff straight out of my workout journal and post it shortly. As you will see it's not always pretty or very well organized but I enjoy my time in the gym which I think is most important.

Thanks for your input!

 

[2skinny]

I just realized that all this time I'm spending on this forum has really thrown my workout/eat/sleep schedule way off. Researching anabolism can be very catabolic if not closely monitered. Oh the irony!

 

[neoborn]

I just realized that all this time I'm spending on this forum has really thrown my workout/eat/sleep schedule way off. Researching anabolism can be very catabolic if not closely monitered. Oh the irony!

So, so very true!

Much Love,

Neoborn

 

[Wilderbeast]

It's good to see someone concerned enough about their post cycle and their health to do careful research. You're one of the smart ones out there skinny. GL!!

 

[2skinny]

It's good to see someone concerned enough about their post cycle and their health to do careful research. You're one of the smart ones out there skinny. GL!!

Well I wouldn't consider myself to be all that smart, I'm just learning to be a little more careful because I know how foolish I can be. Ha ha.

 

[2skinny]

Alright, I will attempt to post a bit of my workout log for anyone curious. Funny, I feel as if I'm putting up some personal information...like I'm going to be laughed at by all the behemoth bodybuilders out there throwing around massive amounts of weight. Maybe I should modify some of my numbers a little. Ha ha, j/k. No shame!
Here are some samples:
Legs & Shoulders Day (only logging working sets, not warm ups)
Squats - 225/3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3
185/5, 5, 5
Between each set of 3 I rested about 20 secs. Once I completed those six mini sets, I rested for 2 mins and then went down to 185. Once again I rested for 20secs between each set of 5. I use this technique in many of my workouts.
Standing barbell press (shoudlers) -
115/2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2
115/2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2
15-20 sec breaks between mini sets, 2 min breaks between main sets.
Walking lunges w/ dumbbells - 50lb dumbbells, 2 or 3 sets
Dumbbell lateral raises (straight sets) -
25/10, 25/8, 25/8
Hang Cleans -
135/6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6
Dumbbell shrugs -
90/6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6


I'll usually include my rear delts in this workout as well with 3 straight sets.
I only did two leg exercises that day which I was fine with. I got my squats in (the king of all exercises) and it will only be a few days before I hit my legs once again. I like this routine because I can work out my muscles more often and therefore it's not a huge deal if I don't complete a Mr O workout every time I go to the gym.
I know that my muscles do not need a week to recover, so with this 3 on 1 off, I hit each muscle group every 4 days (ideally).
Anway, good luck with making sense out of this. I will try an log my workouts more thoroughly once I begin the cycle. I think they will be much more interesting then.

Mountainboy, the 3 exercises I love for traps are hang cleans, barbell shrugs and dumbbell shrugs. I'll do at least two of those for a trap workout. With barbell shrugs I go as long as I can without straps but my grip usually gives out before my traps do so thats when I strap up. I also focus on using a full range of motion, squeezing hard for 1 or 2 secs up top.

 

[mountainboy]

Alright, I will attempt to post a bit of my workout log for anyone curious. Funny, I feel as if I'm putting up some personal information...like I'm going to be laughed at by all the behemoth bodybuilders out there throwing around massive amounts of weight. Maybe I should modify some of my numbers a little. Ha ha, j/k. No shame!
Here are some samples:
Legs & Shoulders Day (only logging working sets, not warm ups)
Squats - 225/3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3
185/5, 5, 5
Between each set of 3 I rested about 20 secs. Once I completed those six mini sets, I rested for 2 mins and then went down to 185. Once again I rested for 20secs between each set of 5. I use this technique in many of my workouts.
Standing barbell press (shoudlers) -
115/2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2
115/2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2
15-20 sec breaks between mini sets, 2 min breaks between main sets.
Walking lunges w/ dumbbells - 50lb dumbbells, 2 or 3 sets
Dumbbell lateral raises (straight sets) -
25/10, 25/8, 25/8
Hang Cleans -
135/6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6
Dumbbell shrugs -
90/6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6


I'll usually include my rear delts in this workout as well with 3 straight sets.
I only did two leg exercises that day which I was fine with. I got my squats in (the king of all exercises) and it will only be a few days before I hit my legs once again. I like this routine because I can work out my muscles more often and therefore it's not a huge deal if I don't complete a Mr O workout every time I go to the gym.
I know that my muscles do not need a week to recover, so with this 3 on 1 off, I hit each muscle group every 4 days (ideally).
Anway, good luck with making sense out of this. I will try an log my workouts more thoroughly once I begin the cycle. I think they will be much more interesting then.

Mountainboy, the 3 exercises I love for traps are hang cleans, barbell shrugs and dumbbell shrugs. I'll do at least two of those for a trap workout. With barbell shrugs I go as long as I can without straps but my grip usually gives out before my traps do so thats when I strap up. I also focus on using a full range of motion, squeezing hard for 1 or 2 secs up top.

thanks 2skinny, I see you do alot of sets for your workouts, maybe I'll try that w/ my trap excersises, I normally only do 3 set max. Thanks for posting the info:lol: