Epistane Cycle Log (First Cycle)

[zigzagzig]

I am a natural skinny fat dude, I have a limited bone structure: tiny wrists, ankles, and shoulders, and a strong tendency to build fat from extra calories. For 3 years I have been lifting regularly, my strength has increase a lot, but although I was able to put some mass and improve muscle toning, I’m having a hard time keep improving these two.

As I’m getting older (33) and after doing some research, I decided to start cycling. The goal was to do a first “cycle” on a very natural compound, like ARA, and then move up to a PH later one. I’ve just finished a 40 workout-days ARA “cycle”, on which I build the discipline of a log, tested my reactions, and observed psychological effects on having an “exogenous” push.

Indeed, it helped me add 4 lbs of lean muscle, and now I am hooked on getting more. I am ready to start an Epistane cycle in two weeks, and I wonder your opinion on my plan.

Current stats:
Age: 33
Height: 5’11
Weight: 164
Body fat: 13-15%
Testosterone (07/14/17): 819.09nd/dL

GP Epistane (weeks 1 to 6, daily)
30mg/30/45/45/45/45

PCT

Clomid (weeks 7 to 11, daliy)
50mg (first 3 days),25/25/12.5/12.5/12.5

Reduce XT (weeks 8 to 11, 2 caps daily), for cortisol control

Inhibit E (weeks 12 to 15, 2 caps daily), to avoid estrogen rebounds

Naturally, I will be taking commonly used supplements, like creatine (5g), milk thistle, and multivitamins. However, for some I may increase their dosage just in case:

Lethargy: BCAA
Joints: Fish Oils
Flu: Vitamin C (2,000mg daily)/ Zinc (50mg daily)

I’m hitting the gym 4/5 days a week. Along these years, I’ve tested the length of my cardio. Too much of it would impair my muscle gains, too little, would lead me to accumulate fat. My sweet spot is a 20min warm up jogging at 5.2 mph @ 1% incline. It helps me a lot on my cardio capacity to do this jogging before weight training.

Day 1) Chest/Triceps
Day 2) Leg/ Abs
Day 3) Rest
Day 4) Shoulder/ Abs
Day 5) Back/ Biceps
Day 6) Rest

Some questions
1) I am still looking for test boosters. Suggestions? Should I take a different one for on cycle and PCT?
2) Epistane is a natural aromatase suppressant. I have an OTC (Inhibit-E), but should I have a pharma AI in hands?
3) I will do a bloodwork one week before starting it. Any special recommendations?

 

[PoSiTiVeFLoW]

Sent you a PM but 1) skip test boosters (fenugreek, tribulus type) buy TUDCA instead. Or more pharma SERM like Novla or clomid. Those will actually restart gonads and boost free T levels...

2.) AI should not be needed for Epistane, save your Armistane for post cycle here.

3) before / after and even mid or end of cycle blood work tracking can tell you a ton about yourself. Track TSH, LSH, ALT, AST, Free T, total T, lipids, creatinine, total blood counts on occasion too.

 

[booneman77]

I am a natural skinny fat dude, I have a limited bone structure: tiny wrists, ankles, and shoulders, and a strong tendency to build fat from extra calories. For 3 years I have been lifting regularly, my strength has increase a lot, but although I was able to put some mass and improve muscle toning, I’m having a hard time keep improving these two.

As I’m getting older (33) and after doing some research, I decided to start cycling. The goal was to do a first “cycle” on a very natural compound, like ARA, and then move up to a PH later one. I’ve just finished a 40 workout-days ARA “cycle”, on which I build the discipline of a log, tested my reactions, and observed psychological effects on having an “exogenous” push.

Indeed, it helped me add 4 lbs of lean muscle, and now I am hooked on getting more. I am ready to start an Epistane cycle in two weeks, and I wonder your opinion on my plan.

Current stats:
Age: 33
Height: 5’11
Weight: 164
Body fat: 13-15%
Testosterone (07/14/17): 819.09nd/dL

GP Epistane (weeks 1 to 6, daily)
30mg/30/45/45/45/45

PCT

Clomid (weeks 7 to 11, daliy)
50mg (first 3 days),25/25/12.5/12.5/12.5

Reduce XT (weeks 8 to 11, 2 caps daily), for cortisol control

Inhibit E (weeks 12 to 15, 2 caps daily), to avoid estrogen rebounds

Naturally, I will be taking commonly used supplements, like creatine (5g), milk thistle, and multivitamins. However, for some I may increase their dosage just in case:

Lethargy: BCAA
Joints: Fish Oils
Flu: Vitamin C (2,000mg daily)/ Zinc (50mg daily)

I’m hitting the gym 4/5 days a week. Along these years, I’ve tested the length of my cardio. Too much of it would impair my muscle gains, too little, would lead me to accumulate fat. My sweet spot is a 20min warm up jogging at 5.2 mph @ 1% incline. It helps me a lot on my cardio capacity to do this jogging before weight training.

Day 1) Chest/Triceps
Day 2) Leg/ Abs
Day 3) Rest
Day 4) Shoulder/ Abs
Day 5) Back/ Biceps
Day 6) Rest

Some questions
1) I am still looking for test boosters. Suggestions? Should I take a different one for on cycle and PCT?
2) Epistane is a natural aromatase suppressant. I have an OTC (Inhibit-E), but should I have a pharma AI in hands?
3) I will do a bloodwork one week before starting it. Any special recommendations?

you need cycle support and tudca on cycle - CEL Cycle Assist and Tudca are my go to's. no test booster on cycle (its pointless), but you could add CEL M-Test to pct for a little extra help recovering.

i always suggest having a pharma ai on hand just in case... you shouldn't need it, but its best to be safe (especially post cycle).

 

[zigzagzig]

Sent you a PM but 1) skip test boosters (fenugreek, tribulus type) buy TUDCA instead. Or more pharma SERM like Novla or clomid. Those will actually restart gonads and boost free T levels...

2.) AI should not be needed for Epistane, save your Armistane for post cycle here.

3) before / after and even mid or end of cycle blood work tracking can tell you a ton about yourself. Track TSH, LSH, ALT, AST, Free T, total T, lipids, creatinine, total blood counts on occasion too.

I have Inhibit-E instead of Armistane, are they similar? I am planning to take 2 caps of Inhibit-E daily during PCT

 

[zigzagzig]

you need cycle support and tudca on cycle - CEL Cycle Assist and Tudca are my go to's. no test booster on cycle (its pointless), but you could add CEL M-Test to pct for a little extra help recovering.

i always suggest having a pharma ai on hand just in case... you shouldn't need it, but its best to be safe (especially post cycle).

I got CEL Cycle Assist and Tudca for on cycle support. For PCT is CEL-M and CEL-PCT assist similar?

 

[PoSiTiVeFLoW]

I have Inhibit-E instead of Armistane, are they similar? I am planning to take 2 caps of Inhibit-E daily during PCT

I would use Armistane primary, inhibit e by SNS is different, but complimentary complex of support... could use together.

 

[booneman77]

I have Inhibit-E instead of Armistane, are they similar? I am planning to take 2 caps of Inhibit-E daily during PCT

Not really similar as arimistane has been shown to have almost no ai effects. It really only does a little for cortisol and is mostly just useless. Inhibit e is a completely different ingredient and has bloodwork showing its lowering of e2

I got CEL Cycle Assist and Tudca for on cycle support. For PCT is CEL-M and CEL-PCT assist similar?

They are similar but ahve somewhat different purposes... I would choose m-test personally as its a better natty test booster and you can cover any other bases with other products if needed.

 

[PoSiTiVeFLoW]

Not really similar as arimistane has been shown to have almost no ai effects. It really only does a little for cortisol and is mostly just useless. Inhibit e is a completely different ingredient and has bloodwork showing its lowering of e2



They are similar but ahve somewhat different purposes... I would choose m-test personally as its a better natty test booster and you can cover any other bases with other products if needed.

Really? Thought armistane was considered a reasonably strong suicide AI? Odd, Lecheek nutrition usually does a good job on activate ingredient choice... not effective in real research?

So sell all my Ad-3 PCT bottles? Better AI would be exemestane? Or inhibit E complex here works well?

Wow lot of misinformation on Armistane out there then... and just in time for my first rebound gyno flare up.

 

[booneman77]

Really? Thought armistane was considered a reasonably strong suicide AI? Odd, Lecheek nutrition usually does a good job on activate ingredient choice... not effective in real research?

So sell all my Ad-3 PCT bottles? Better AI would be exemestane? Or inhibit E complex here works well?

Wow lot of misinformation on Armistane out there then... and just in time for my first rebound gyno flare up.

years ago everyone thought this and thats why theres so many arim products and its in a ton of pct products... thats since been proven incorrect though.

exemestane is a pharma grade ai and has ALWAYS been FAR FAR FAR superior to even the "assumed" effects of arimistane. they were never even in the same convo.

inhibit e is a completely different ingredient and has actual bloodwork to show its effects on estrogen so yes, if you need a reasonably strong but not quite pharma grade ai, its a great choice. Theres really only a few otc options worth anything on the market.

 

[PoSiTiVeFLoW]

years ago everyone thought this and thats why theres so many arim products and its in a ton of pct products... thats since been proven incorrect though.

exemestane is a pharma grade ai and has ALWAYS been FAR FAR FAR superior to even the "assumed" effects of arimistane. they were never even in the same convo.

inhibit e is a completely different ingredient and has actual bloodwork to show its effects on estrogen so yes, if you need a reasonably strong but not quite pharma grade ai, its a great choice. Theres really only a few otc options worth anything on the market.

Well much appreciated. Shoot looks like i have some Ebay work to do.

 

[zigzagzig]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I got my GP's Epistane, and I realized each cap has a 20mg, so I will change my dosage to 40/40/40/60/60/60. If 60mg becomes too much on the last week I may come back to 40mg. I also got CEL Cycle Assist, the suggest use is 4 caps twice a day. Is it overshooting?

Any recommendations on how and when during the day to take Epistane, Cycle Assist and Tudca during cycle?

 

[PoSiTiVeFLoW]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I got my GP's Epistane, and I realized each cap has a 20mg, so I will change my dosage to 40/40/40/60/60/60. If 60mg becomes too much on the last week I may come back to 40mg. I also got CEL Cycle Assist, the suggest use is 4 caps twice a day. Is it overshooting?

Any recommendations on how and when during the day to take Epistane, Cycle Assist and Tudca during cycle?

Looks reasonable, can always add a dose assessment 20mg day just to make sure, if first time research with new compound.

I have a little 1 yr old, in the house, and work... so do all my research first thing AM, PWO, or after lunch at work too.

 

[booneman77]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I got my GP's Epistane, and I realized each cap has a 20mg, so I will change my dosage to 40/40/40/60/60/60. If 60mg becomes too much on the last week I may come back to 40mg. I also got CEL Cycle Assist, the suggest use is 4 caps twice a day. Is it overshooting?

Any recommendations on how and when during the day to take Epistane, Cycle Assist and Tudca during cycle?

take the full 8 cap dose of the cycle assist. that's how its meant to be dosed (8 caps seems like a lot, but thats how many you need to get the effective doses of all the items in there). defintely add the TUDCA too.

Dose your epi split through the day, preferably with some fats, and dose your cycle supports away from the epi (just a couple hours apart is plenty)

 

[zigzagzig]

Thanks for the info.

I'm doing my blood work tomorrow morning and I will probably start the cycle by the end of the week.

Is 750mg of Tudca per day a good dosage during the 6 weeks of cycle?

 

[ZachH]

Thanks for the info.

I'm doing my blood work tomorrow morning and I will probably start the cycle by the end of the week.

Is 750mg of Tudca per day a good dosage during the 6 weeks of cycle?

In to see how you progress and yes 750-1000 will be perfect

 

[zigzagzig]

I have all the stack with me and I am good to go. I'll probably take my first dose of Epi this Saturday or Monday, not sure yet. However, I must confess that given the build up excitement I may start this Saturday.

I'm now at 165.2 lbs, 14.1% body fat (according to my generic weight balance), and 15 1/4 biceps, unpumped. I'll do more measurements on the days to come to better track my progression. By what I've red in other logs, people have an average lean gain of ~8lbs on Epi. Everyone is different, but I just to set a value, I expect - not a goal - to reach 172lbs at 13% body fat by the end of it. Maybe I'll retain 5lbs from these on the long run. Thoughts?

 

[Alistair_]

You do know that Epistane is an aromatase inhibitor that has been methylated making it even stronger? I think it's crazy running it without testosterone and I speak from experience. Ran epi at 30mg a day 9 years ago with no test base and it screwed my tendons up pretty bad. Gained 7 pounds of lean mass.

 

[zigzagzig]

You do know that Epistane is an aromatase inhibitor that has been methylated making it even stronger? I think it's crazy running it without testosterone and I speak from experience. Ran epi at 30mg a day 9 years ago with no test base and it screwed my tendons up pretty bad. Gained 7 pounds of lean mass.

I know it is methylated but I've also notice there are many here who have run it as a first cycle with good results and minimal sides. My current plan is to use glucosamine and/or taurine for tendon/joint issues. Now, what kind of test base would you suggest I should add? Wouldn't it become to harsh given it is my first cycle? I'm really curious about it...

 

[Alistair_]

Test E or Test C. I would never run an oral AAS longer than 3 weeks. You could use Epi at 30mg a day to kickstart a test cycle. Test is quite mild as long as estrogen is addressed and it really should be the base of any AAS stack.

 

[ZachH]

4 andro oral or transdermal, or TD trest as a base if you're not into needles yet. Ill be running epistane/halodrol/4andro/epiandro for 8 weeks in about a month. As long as youre taking tudca and other support supps you can run epistane at least 45 days.

 

[zigzagzig]

I would prefer not to go on oral if I run an AAS. So, as you are right, I'm not into needles yet, maybe the 4 andro oral could be a choice.

Besides tendon issues, I imagine that staking andro 4 and Epi would bring better results, or not? Wouldn't it be too much for a first cycle? Would I run both at the same time for 6 weeks?

 

[ZachH]

I would prefer not to go on oral if I run an AAS. So, as you are right, I'm not into needles yet, maybe the 4 andro oral could be a choice.

Besides tendon issues, I imagine that staking andro 4 and Epi would bring better results, or not? Wouldn't it be too much for a first cycle? Would I run both at the same time for 6 weeks?

Yes. Pm sent for 4 andro. Run the 4 andro 300-450mg per day (2-3 caps) for the full 6 weeks. Will definitely not be too much for first cycle they will work synergistically together since epistane is dry and 4 andro is somewhat wet.

 

[zigzagzig]

My only reservation with the 4 andro is that depending on its "version" it has the potential to mess too much with my hormonal balance. The two "versions" are: the 4AD and the 4-DHEA. Right?! The first is a one-step precursor to test, and the latter is a two-step one. However, 4-DHEA it is the only one available in the US. On the trade-off between running my chances of having the 4AD seized on a shipment from the U.K. and having the 4-DHEA easily in hands, but messing too much on my endocrine system, I'm leaning to the first. What you guys think?

 

[Scrutiny]

My only reservation with the 4 andro is that depending on its "version" it has the potential to mess too much with my hormonal balance. The two "versions" are: the 4AD and the 4-DHEA. Right?! The first is a one-step precursor to test, and the latter is a two-step one. However, 4-DHEA it is the only one available in the US. On the trade-off between running my chances of having the 4AD seized on a shipment from the U.K. and having the 4-DHEA easily in hands, but messing too much on my endocrine system, I'm leaning to the first. What you guys think?

Go for the real 4AD, look at Predator Nutrition online and go with their Andro-Test (It's the real 4AD, the 1 step away from Test).
I had blood work done to back this up and 3 caps per day (minimum recommended dosage) had my total test sitting at 520 ng/dl in the middle of my Trest cycle which Trest shuts down Test big time.

4-DHEA in my experience is garbage. All I experienced was bloat, sub par libido and bad estrogenic sides even with Arimidex in the mix. You should be fine getting in 4AD, I get it in here to AUS no dramas.

 

[Alistair_]

How is "real 4-AD" being sold legally? Or is this from an underground lab?

 

[Alistair_]

Zigzag, I'd save the Epi for when you're ready to run test and for now run LGD 4033 at 10mg a day for a few weeks. Most SARMS aren't worth a crap but LDG is very good or at least I got great results with it after getting nothing from RAD-140.

You can find LGD 4033 for around $30 a gram and make your own liquid.

 

[zigzagzig]

I will actually get the "real 4-AD" from a friend, but he will only have it one month from now. He has Halo as of now, so I may change my first cycle to Halo (6 weeks) and do the Epistane + "real 4-AD" as second one. Thoughts?!

 

[PoSiTiVeFLoW]

How is "real 4-AD" being sold legally? Or is this from an underground lab?

UK has it, not illegal there. And they can ship worldwide, or to ban happy USA. Also, research chem labs in US carry it sometimes as well.

 

[PoSiTiVeFLoW]

Go for the real 4AD, look at Predator Nutrition online and go with their Andro-Test (It's the real 4AD, the 1 step away from Test).
I had blood work done to back this up and 3 caps per day (minimum recommended dosage) had my total test sitting at 520 ng/dl in the middle of my Trest cycle which Trest shuts down Test big time.

4-DHEA in my experience is garbage. All I experienced was bloat, sub par libido and bad estrogenic sides even with Arimidex in the mix. You should be fine getting in 4AD, I get it in here to AUS no dramas.

Yeah get real 4-AD. I was looking at the same Andro-Test on Predator. Good to know it's legit. I still have some purerawz lying around for this spring to use.

However, I have also been considering a TRT service I see being test run on AM here, looks pretty pro. Thinking of finally crossing to the dark side and getting the Test cyp a run, to see if it helps?

TBH - All of my oral cycles 6-7 past 2 years, mostly DMZ, Epi, M1AD, S-drol, LGD-4033 and MK-677 most of the way through - I never used a test base at all. And got great results went from 175 and 19% BF to now at 224 and 16% after 2 years, just getting off a bulk cycle. Feel fine, flag still stands at attention, health is good. Better than it has been in a long time actually.

Next I'm thinking of 2nd run with Ostarine to cut 210lbs and 12-13% BF pretty fast, after work trip and PCT first, Novla SERM based. So lean muscle wise, I'm ~40lbs in 2 years work or so.

Nevertheless - I think cyclically suppressing ones HPTA / Test-levels can maybe cause issues over time? So the test base makes sense to prevent lethargy and not deprive yourself of natural test, throughout harsher oral cycles?

Not an expert here, as I've been doing mine with oral only cycles with liver cleanse, and other cycle support. I was also not PCT'ing properly first 4-5 cycles, as noted before I did not have an emergency SERM / AI pharma grade in my cabinet until I just got a little right nip gyno I killed off. Armistane is not enough of a real AI, get Exemestane. BLR Rebirth is not a pharma grade SERM, at least not for me according to blood work compared to Novla.

 

[Alistair_]

That's odd that it's legal in the U.K. I'm going there in a few weeks. Wish I could pick up a few grams of 4-AD to use transdermal. It's oral absorption sucks

 

[zigzagzig]

Hey guys, I’m ready to start my Halodrol cycle a couple days from now and I would appreciate your thought. The plan detailed below already takes into account many of your previous comments. Thanks again for the support.

I’ll do a 3 days + 6 weeks cycle. The first 3 days are just a “check-in phase”, so that I can observe how my body reacts to these compounds.

Halodrol
(GP Pharma Halo25: 4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1,4-diene-3-17b-diol)
Days 1 to 3: 25mg daily
Weeks 1 to 6: 50mg/50/50/50/50/75

On-cycle support
1) CEL Assist: 8 caps a day for the 3 days +6 weeks;
2) Tudca: 750mg a day for the 3days+6weeks;
3) Creatine, BCAA, Omega-3, Multivitamin, 2 gallons of water per day.

PCT
1) Clomid (weeks 7 to 11, daliy): 50mg (first 3 days after PH), then 25/25/12.5/12.5/12.5;
2) M-Test (weeks 7 to 11, 6 caps daily):
3) Reduce XT (weeks 8 to 11, 2 caps daily), for cortisol control;
4) Inhibit-E (weeks 12 to 15, 2 caps daily), to avoid estrogen rebounds;


4-AD
If I get the 4-AD in time, I’ll add it as a test base. I’m worried about lethargy. I’m just not sure about the dosage, I’m currently targeting it at 250mg daily from the 3rd week to the last.

(FS Androtest: 4-androstenediol Cyclodextrin Complex)
Week 3 to 6: 250mg daily


Schedule
I’ll take CEL Assist + Tudca a couple hours apart from Halo in the morning and then the same approach in the evening before going to the gym.

(i) Any thoughts if Halo or (CEL Assist + Tudca) should be taken with food or empty stomach?
(ii) Also, If I add 4-AD, which time of the day (with or without food) should I take it?

Thanks!

 

[booneman77]

Hey guys, I’m ready to start my Halodrol cycle a couple days from now and I would appreciate your thought. The plan detailed below already takes into account many of your previous comments. Thanks again for the support.

I’ll do a 3 days + 6 weeks cycle. The first 3 days are just a “check-in phase”, so that I can observe how my body reacts to these compounds.

Halodrol
(GP Pharma Halo25: 4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1,4-diene-3-17b-diol)
Days 1 to 3: 25mg daily
Weeks 1 to 6: 50mg/50/50/50/50/75

On-cycle support
1) CEL Assist: 8 caps a day for the 3 days +6 weeks;
2) Tudca: 750mg a day for the 3days+6weeks;
3) Creatine, BCAA, Omega-3, Multivitamin, 2 gallons of water per day.

PCT
1) Clomid (weeks 7 to 11, daliy): 50mg (first 3 days after PH), then 25/25/12.5/12.5/12.5;
2) M-Test (weeks 7 to 11, 6 caps daily):
3) Reduce XT (weeks 8 to 11, 2 caps daily), for cortisol control;
4) Inhibit-E (weeks 12 to 15, 2 caps daily), to avoid estrogen rebounds;


4-AD
If I get the 4-AD in time, I’ll add it as a test base. I’m worried about lethargy. I’m just not sure about the dosage, I’m currently targeting it at 250mg daily from the 3rd week to the last.

(FS Androtest: 4-androstenediol Cyclodextrin Complex)
Week 3 to 6: 250mg daily


Schedule
I’ll take CEL Assist + Tudca a couple hours apart from Halo in the morning and then the same approach in the evening before going to the gym.

(i) Any thoughts if Halo or (CEL Assist + Tudca) should be taken with food or empty stomach?
(ii) Also, If I add 4-AD, which time of the day (with or without food) should I take it?

Thanks!

dont even bother with the 3-day thing... you're just wasting your time. it wont kick in or have any effect in that time and that dose is pointless. jsut go 50 from the start.

take the halo with some fats (either food or some fish oil), supports can be taken either way.

same rules for the 4ad, dose with fats. I would just dose it the same times as the halo for simplicity

 

[zigzagzig]

I'm starting the cycle today with 25mg of Halo, two hours before workout. Tomorrow, I'll get to 25mg in the morning and 25mg in the evening.

 

[zigzagzig]

Yesterday, I took 25mg, one hour before going to the gym and today it was the first day I took it 2 x 25mg. Naturally, I haven't noticed any major change in strength, weight or body composition. Currently, I'm at 165.5lbs, 14.5% body fat (according to my generic scale).

 

[BlueberyJones]

Hey guys, I’m ready to start my Halodrol cycle a couple days from now and I would appreciate your thought. The plan detailed below already takes into account many of your previous comments. Thanks again for the support.

I’ll do a 3 days + 6 weeks cycle. The first 3 days are just a “check-in phase”, so that I can observe how my body reacts to these compounds.

Halodrol
(GP Pharma Halo25: 4-chloro-17a-methyl-androst-1,4-diene-3-17b-diol)
Days 1 to 3: 25mg daily
Weeks 1 to 6: 50mg/50/50/50/50/75

On-cycle support
1) CEL Assist: 8 caps a day for the 3 days +6 weeks;
2) Tudca: 750mg a day for the 3days+6weeks;
3) Creatine, BCAA, Omega-3, Multivitamin, 2 gallons of water per day.

PCT
1) Clomid (weeks 7 to 11, daliy): 50mg (first 3 days after PH), then 25/25/12.5/12.5/12.5;
2) M-Test (weeks 7 to 11, 6 caps daily):
3) Reduce XT (weeks 8 to 11, 2 caps daily), for cortisol control;
4) Inhibit-E (weeks 12 to 15, 2 caps daily), to avoid estrogen rebounds;


4-AD
If I get the 4-AD in time, I’ll add it as a test base. I’m worried about lethargy. I’m just not sure about the dosage, I’m currently targeting it at 250mg daily from the 3rd week to the last.

(FS Androtest: 4-androstenediol Cyclodextrin Complex)
Week 3 to 6: 250mg daily


Schedule
I’ll take CEL Assist + Tudca a couple hours apart from Halo in the morning and then the same approach in the evening before going to the gym.

(i) Any thoughts if Halo or (CEL Assist + Tudca) should be taken with food or empty stomach?
(ii) Also, If I add 4-AD, which time of the day (with or without food) should I take it?

Thanks!

Personally I'd drop the creatine on cycle and use it in your post cycle stack and run your clomid 25 mg all the way through instead of tapering

 

[zigzagzig]

Personally I'd drop the creatine on cycle and use it in your post cycle stack and run your clomid 25 mg all the way through instead of tapering

What's the rational behind postponing the creatine?

 

[zigzagzig]

Second day. No changes in weight. However, I felt less tired after 1 1/4 hour in the gym. I just wanted to continue training. Currently, I'm getting 2300kcal per day. 210g P.

On the other hand, I had a slight loss on strength and an increase in overall soreness.

 

[BlueberyJones]

What's the rational behind postponing the creatine?

Because what you're taking is already liver toxic and creatine can make things harsher on the liver, I highly doubt it would make a huge impact though this is just what I would do man. Plus, I don't think you're going to make substantially more gains taking it while on cycle. Post cycle on the other hand it could help you keep a little more

 

[zigzagzig]

Because what you're taking is already liver toxic and creatine can make things harsher on the liver, I highly doubt it would make a huge impact though this is just what I would do man. Plus, I don't think you're going to make substantially more gains taking it while on cycle. Post cycle on the other hand it could help you keep a little more

Makes sense, I'll reduce my creatine intake each day until it's zeroed by the end of the week.

 

[zigzagzig]

3rd day: weight is up by half a pound. I can't feel my muscles getting tired during the workout but I'm still very sore in the morning. I'm adding a scoop of BCAA post wo besides the scoop I take right before it.

 

[zigzagzig]

4th day: weigh +1lbs, morning soreness got very mild after I started taking on scoop of BCAA before and one after wo. Strength is improving. Yesterday was shoulders day, on standing barbell press I got a good progression from one set of 8x80, one 8x90, and 2x8x100. That's a 10lbs increase on each set. Today is rest day.

 

[zigzagzig]

I'm thinking about getting to 75mg/day at the end of the first week. Just got the 4-AD, I'll probably anticipate it too, starting at 125mg/day this Saturday. Any thoughts about 4-AD dosage?

 

[zigzagzig]

6th day: Leg day. Squat is up to 12x40 + 12x110 + 10x180 + 3x8x220. I've increased Halo to 75mg, and I've added 4-AD at 125mg. Weight is up by almost 2lbs. My muscle density looks higher, I look more lean and wider. Although, I also feel that I have less fat, my scale says that I'm at 14.9% (+0.4p.p.).

 

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7th day: Chest and triceps day. Weight is up by 2lbs. Size is slightly increasing, but I've been noticing a much bigger improvement in density, hardness and definition. Fat definitely looks much lower overall, but my scale says it is up to 15%. Also, I've been noticing a much wider change in belly fat along the day. Early in the morning my abs look OK, but by dinner time it looks like there was a whole new layer of fat. Naturally, I did experience that before, but now it is much more pronounced.

Bench press weight increased by 10lbs on last two sets: now at 12x45 + 10x95 + 8x145 + 2x6x190. As it is (was) Saturday, I've indulged myself in the gym, workout lasted 1 3/4 hours. Endurance has gone through the roof, I could have done more exercises, but overtraining was already knocking on the door.

 

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Week 2, day 8: Rest day. Weight up by 2lbs.

 

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Week 2, day 9: Back and biceps day. Weight is up by almost 2.5 lbs. Strength is increasing on all exercises, got a PR on EZ barbell preacher curl, warm up 1x12x50lbs, + 3x8x90lbs. Pull ups at 5 sets of 7. Back and chest are getting bigger, arms not so much

 

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Week 2, day 10: Shoulders day.

Weigh: +2 3/4 lbs

Improvements on overhead press:
I generally prefer to start my workout with a compound exercise and then move to ancillary ones. On shoulders day like today, I generally start with a standing overhead press. Not so long ago, I used to start with a seated overhead press or in a machine shoulder press. For a long time, I was reluctant to make that change because this is a more challenging exercise, requiring a better overall balance and technique to not let the barbell get out of my center of gravity. Also, as I had to start from the scratch, i.e. using only the plain olympic barbell weight (45lbs), and given that I was already lifting 170lbs on the machine, I experienced a light demotivation in the beginning. Indeed, it was hard to properly make the balance with just 65lbs of total weight. After some weeks, my body was able to adapt to the new exercise but increasing the weight on it has been very hard. Since I started the cycle there has been an heterogeneous improvement in strength, higher on back and shoulders exercises, and less on chest and arms. Today I got a PR on the standing overhead press: 120lbs, on my third set of 6 repetitions.

 

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Week 2, day 11: Legs day.

Weight: +3lbs (early morning measurement)

I was expecting some large weight swings day from day, but my weight according to early morning measurements is changing on a very stable pace. I can't say the same about my weight when measured in the evening. Even though I stick to my macros goals, I find it hard to predict my evening measurement. Yesterday, night I was +6lbs. Probably water retention?

 

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Week 2, day 12: rest day.

 

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Week 2, day 13: my TG trip took longer than I thought, forced rest day.