Going.... UP!

[chasec]

My new cycle is underway now, thought i'd share it with those of you who either give a damn, or are looking to run the same thing. Briefly, it looks like this...

Week 1-12 - 600mg Test E/Week
Week 1-4 - 40mg Winstrol/QD
Week 2-14 250iu HCG 2x/Week
Week 2-14 50mcg T3/QD
Week 6-10 75mg Tren Ace/EOD
Week 13-15 Lean Xtreme (regular doseage)
Week 13-14 40mg Nolvadex/QD
Week 14-15 20mg Nolvadex QD


I'm thinking of picking up a mg of LR3-IGF1 to run during PCT, but right now it's not definitive. I'm currently on week 2, and the winstrol is starting to take effect. I've started the T3, and i've noticed it makes me dog ass tired for some reason. I'm really shedding hair at an appreciable rate, so i'm looking forward to stopping the winstrol. I'll be picking up some hair care products for when i start the tren. A little DHT blocking in the scalp will help out a lot I bet. I'm keeping cals high, around 4300/day right now with a 45/30/25 split right now. It's been pretty clean so far, but taco bell is inevitable at some point in the near future. I'll be updating at least 2x/week

 

[CEDeoudes59]

goodluck, is this your 2nd or 3rd cycle?

 

[chasec]

it's my 3rd. i've ran a couple of insignificant PH cycles in the past, but i've only ran 2 "real" cycles that were fairly short ~<6 weeks

 

[CEDeoudes59]

i got you, why not more test..? say 750 or upwards

 

[klugman]

could you post how your daily intake of 4300 cals breaks down???

I would appreciate it.

 

[chasec]

i got you, why not more test..? say 750 or upwards

in all likelihood i will bump it up. I made good gains off 500mg/week prop last go round. i'm just trying to keep the doseage in reasonable ranges right now. if i can gain off of it, than i'm still good.

750mg does sound nice.... its still only 3cc/week too


damn you CED, now i'm tempted to up it

 

[CEDeoudes59]

well, I mean that Tren or Winny is stronger than 500mg of any type of Test will ever be... up it and enjoy it psychologically

 

[3clipseGT]

Hey bro im not tryin to jack ur thread i just have a question.

Deo say someone runs a cycle for 4 weeks, and it sucked totaly, allergic to the dermal and whathave you and does a shitty cycle, does PCT and everything correct, then hops on again like a week after PCT is done and does a 14 week cycle, how much do you think hed gain off test and decca test at 500mgs ( probly bump it up at the end with prop at say 750 or so) deca at 400mgs given his diet and trainin is in order and he didnt gain anything off the previous "screwed up cycle".

If you'd like for me to remove this bro np just figured id ask here real quick.

 

[chasec]

could you post how your daily intake of 4300 cals breaks down???

I would appreciate it.

45/30/25 split

so 45% kcal carbo's
(4300 x .45)/4 = 483g CHO/day

30% protein
(4300 x .3)/4 = 322g protein/day

25% fat
(4300 x .25)/9 = 119f fat/day

carbs i get from 2 giant bowls of oatmeal/brown sugar/whole flax. i also have 5-6 slices whole wheat bread, and what ever else whole grain i can get my hands on. protein comes from chicken/beef/pork/whey. i usually don't keep close tabs on fat's. i eat pretty clean and let them fall where they may. i'm sure i get plenty of them though between the 6g fish oil, whole flaxseed, and olive oil i eat every day

 

[chasec]

Hey bro im not tryin to jack ur thread i just have a question.

Deo say someone runs a cycle for 4 weeks, and it sucked totaly, allergic to the dermal and whathave you and does a shitty cycle, does PCT and everything correct, then hops on again like a week after PCT is done and does a 14 week cycle, how much do you think hed gain off test and decca test at 500mgs ( probly bump it up at the end with prop at say 750 or so) deca at 400mgs given his diet and trainin is in order and he didnt gain anything off the previous "screwed up cycle".

If you'd like for me to remove this bro np just figured id ask here real quick.

your cool; i'd say you would still get some pretty nice gains assuming training and diet were in check and you didn't have alot of experience with androgens in the past. If it were me though i'd wait a good month at least to let the HPTA regain equilibrium.

 

[chasec]

well, I mean that Tren or Winny is stronger than 500mg of any type of Test will ever be... up it and enjoy it psychologically

good points. i'll up it end of the week. i'm due up to pin on sat.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

Hey bro im not tryin to jack ur thread i just have a question.

Deo say someone runs a cycle for 4 weeks, and it sucked totaly, allergic to the dermal and whathave you and does a shitty cycle, does PCT and everything correct, then hops on again like a week after PCT is done and does a 14 week cycle, how much do you think hed gain off test and decca test at 500mgs ( probly bump it up at the end with prop at say 750 or so) deca at 400mgs given his diet and trainin is in order and he didnt gain anything off the previous "screwed up cycle".

If you'd like for me to remove this bro np just figured id ask here real quick.

well, keep in mind neither Deca or Testosterone won't truly starting producing retainable anabolic gains until week 5 or beyond.

as for how much someone can gain at 500mg of Test I've found it comes down to 2 things:
1) How close you are to or beyond your genetic limit (primary)
2) Previous PH/AAS experience

basically you could probably use 500mg of test to hit your genetic limit whether that be 140lbs or 260lbs. It varies per person. I personally think anyone over 200lbs and/or with previous PH/AAS shouldn't bother with 500mg of test - start at 750mg. I mean M1T/Superdrol/Methyl-whatever is 100x stronger than 500mg test.

I don't neccessarily believe that once you up the dose there is no going back to a lesser dose. It's more like 500mg will get you to X amount of LBM. 750mg will get you to Y amount of LBM. 1gram will get you to Z amount of LBM. In reality you could start at a gram and gain for several cycles - rather than starting at 500mg and only gaining for 1 cycle. It's a lot of gray and spectulation on my part -- I'm not all THAT experienced

 

[3clipseGT]

But do you think that because say joe was on cycle before but it wasnt good that he wont gain this cycle at 500mgs? I mean roughly how much do you think hed gain? 10lbs?

 

[Ubiquitous]

Week 1-12 - 600mg Test E/Week
Week 1-4 - 40mg Winstrol/QD
Week 2-14 250iu HCG 2x/Week
Week 2-14 50mcg T3/QD
Week 6-10 75mg Tren Ace/EOD
Week 13-15 Lean Xtreme (regular doseage)
Week 13-14 40mg Nolvadex/QD
Week 14-15 20mg Nolvadex QD

I'm surprised noone caught how close you're starting PCT to your cycle. Instead it should be 2 weeks minimum from your last Test E pin.
I'd run Tren Ace 5-10. I'd start with something else than Winny, and if I had to run winny, I'd run it WITH the Tren Ace. I'd also run a heftier PCT. I also wouldn't run HCG into PCT.. others would say it's ok.. but I want to restore my HPTA as quickly as possible instead of chancing further suppression.

But that's me, and you're you. Good luck in either event.. I would seriously push your PCT back though.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

But do you think that because say joe was on cycle before but it wasnt good that he wont gain this cycle at 500mgs? I mean roughly how much do you think hed gain? 10lbs?

if he doesn't have previous AAS/PH experience (not counting the cycle gone bad) he should grow. But if he's close to his genetic limit he may reach that but not go beyond (regardless of AAS experience). It would be impossible for me to say how much he'd gain (focus on LBM, not weight) without knowing his training history, diet, how he responds to AAS, etc.

Have him start out at 500mg and if he isn't up strength and weight by week 6-7 up the dose. Most people, including myself, were not impressed with 500mg of test. But it was hardly our first cycle considering all the PH/Methyl AAS we had done in the past.

 

[3clipseGT]

if he doesn't have previous AAS/PH experience (not counting the cycle gone bad) he should grow. But if he's close to his genetic limit he may reach that but not go beyond (regardless of AAS experience). It would be impossible for me to say how much he'd gain (focus on LBM, not weight) without knowing his training history, diet, how he responds to AAS, etc.

Have him start out at 500mg and if he isn't up strength and weight by week 6-7 up the dose. Most people, including myself, were not impressed with 500mg of test. But it was hardly our first cycle considering all the PH/Methyl AAS we had done in the past.

Aahhh ok thanks.

 

[chasec]

I'm surprised noone caught how close you're starting PCT to your cycle. Instead it should be 2 weeks minimum from your last Test E pin.
I'd run Tren Ace 5-10. I'd start with something else than Winny, and if I had to run winny, I'd run it WITH the Tren Ace. I'd also run a heftier PCT. I also wouldn't run HCG into PCT.. others would say it's ok.. but I want to restore my HPTA as quickly as possible instead of chancing further suppression.

But that's me, and you're you. Good luck in either event.. I would seriously push your PCT back though.

i start PCT at the half life of said ester i'm injecting. So test E with a half life of 10.5 days will be fine starting a week after my last shot. I'd much rather have estrogen in control for a bit longer than have it unchecked for a short period of time.

and what do you mean heftier PCT? 4 weeks nolvadex with a tapered dose is pretty standard. add in a little lean xtreme to help with thyroid recovery, not to mention the HCG that i've been running to keep LH pulse's frequent, i should be good to go.

i'm not going to run the winstrol with the tren; the androgenic effects would drive me crazy.

 

[chasec]

oh, and test got bumped to 800mg this week. :clap2:

 

[Ubiquitous]

i start PCT at the half life of said ester i'm injecting. So test E with a half life of 10.5 days will be fine starting a week after my last shot. I'd much rather have estrogen in control for a bit longer than have it unchecked for a short period of time.

and what do you mean heftier PCT? 4 weeks nolvadex with a tapered dose is pretty standard. add in a little lean xtreme to help with thyroid recovery, not to mention the HCG that i've been running to keep LH pulse's frequent, i should be good to go.

i'm not going to run the winstrol with the tren; the androgenic effects would drive me crazy.

You do realize that considering the half life, you will have built up quite a bit of Test blood levels right.. it's compounded.. that's halflife by the way... at least 2 weeks so you're not wasting your PCT... standard.

You're mimicking LH with HCG.. you're not stimulating it. suppressive.. standard.

I say heftier PCT because you're going to be shut down, for 14 weeks. Nolvadex isn't the cure-all for HPTA recovery IMO... even though you're running it for 4 weeks. I only say this because I get such good recovery on Pheedno's.

Winstrol and Tren is quite the synergistic stack, as well as the purported ant-progestin effect of Winny.

Just my opinion ChaceC. you can take it how you like. You should do a little more reading on half-lives though. Just because a compound is said to have a half-life of 10.5 days (under debate), does NOT mean that it clears in that time... :blink: ahem.

Half-life is my only factual point.. everything else is just a matter of opinon, and personal preference. There are many right ways to run a cycle...

good luck, again.

 

[glenihan]

well i'm going to disagree with Deo as i'm over 200 and i still use only 500mg of test a week

however it is worth noting i use other hormones as well so the total mg of AAS per week is closer to 1000

although right now i'm hormone free

 

[CEDeoudes59]

well i'm going to disagree with Deo as i'm over 200 and i still use only 500mg of test a week

however it is worth noting i use other hormones as well so the total mg of AAS per week is closer to 1000

although right now i'm hormone free

I definitely need a culmulative gram/wk! At least I think... I don't count EQ. very weak

 

[CEDeoudes59]

I like the idea of running HCG 2 weeks into PCT - but making PCT 8 weeks.

 

[chasec]

You do realize that considering the half life, you will have built up quite a bit of Test blood levels right.. it's compounded.. that's halflife by the way... at least 2 weeks so you're not wasting your PCT... standard.

You're mimicking LH with HCG.. you're not stimulating it. suppressive.. standard.

I say heftier PCT because you're going to be shut down, for 14 weeks. Nolvadex isn't the cure-all for HPTA recovery IMO... even though you're running it for 4 weeks. I only say this because I get such good recovery on Pheedno's.

Winstrol and Tren is quite the synergistic stack, as well as the purported ant-progestin effect of Winny.

Just my opinion ChaceC. you can take it how you like. You should do a little more reading on half-lives though. Just because a compound is said to have a half-life of 10.5 days (under debate), does NOT mean that it clears in that time... :blink: ahem.

Half-life is my only factual point.. everything else is just a matter of opinon, and personal preference. There are many right ways to run a cycle...

good luck, again.

i understand what your saying. i'm probably not going to change when i start PCT, but i might extend it. with what your saying about the half life of esters, i know. skye sent me a document that let me calculate exactly how much of each ester would be built up in the bloodstream and how long it would take to clear after i stop the cycle. i was just using the half life as a general reference.

as far as the HCG, it is suppressive, your right. i wasn't trying to say that it was a way to keep me suppressed, becuase there isn't anything you can do to prevent HPTA inhibition. it does mimick the release of LH and keeps my natural T levels up while i'm on, but i'm still suppressed. anyhow, good points

 

[chasec]

I like the idea of running HCG 2 weeks into PCT - but making PCT 8 weeks.

what do you run? tamoxifen, clompihene? SERMS do work on your liver, so i'm trying to keep the use only to what i need. i'll probably pick up some maca and fenugreek after the nolvadex is done

 

[CEDeoudes59]

PCT:
during cycle - 2: HCG
1-4: Clomid
4-8 Nolvadex

that's ideal methinks

don't worry about SERMS and liver damage - if you running winny 1-4 than your liver will be in fine shape when you start PCT.

 

[chasec]

true; how does clomid treat you? it turns me into a moody bitch

 

[CEDeoudes59]

never had any problem -- I'm pretty moody anyway... no noticable change

 

[milwood]

I like the idea of running HCG 2 weeks into PCT - but making PCT 8 weeks.

I like this as well. I'm down for longer PCT's especially after long cycles (thanks Dr. D) and more combos of things, less SERM use overall too.

 

[Grassroots082]

never had any problem -- I'm pretty moody anyway... no noticable change

lol same here cause I never notice any difference taking Clomid.