First Cycle Log: Test C & OL DMZ

TNlifting

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First Cycle Log: Test C & OL DMZ

EDIT: SKIP TO BOTTOM OF THIS POST TO SEE NEW CYCLE LAYOUT

So after about two years of research and contemplation, I think I'm finally ready for my first cycle. I'm looking to start after the new year in early January.

My stats:
22years old, 5'6" ~ 155lbs (will get accurate weigh in on first day) and roughly 13-16% body fat (sorry I'm bad at estimating, will post pics later). 4 years of somewhat serious but mostly recreational training, 2.5 years of serious training and (usually) proper nutrition. So I guess around 6 years total. I've got everything already on hand, so I'm good to go in that aspect.

6 week cycle:
Week 1-6: Test C 300mg (divided into two pins per week)
Week 1-3 kickstart: OL DMZ 20mg/day (may bump up to 40mg for week 3)
Week 1-4: OL Arimicare Pro as directed

PCT will start two weeks after the last pin:
Clomid 25/25/12.5/12.5
Nolva 10/10/5/5
OL Super PCT (10 tabs =1 serving)
0/10/10/10/5/5
Vit D3 5000 IUs/day

Goals: Primary goal is to put on some solid lean mass. Would also like to see some good strength gains. If I lose a couple % body fat then that's great, but if not I won't be too concerned.

Diet: I tend to eat around 2500 mostly clean calories per day. I often eat lower carbs on rest days, but I'm going to forget about that and shoot for 3200 calories per day for the first 3 weeks to take advantage of DMZ's glycogen loading effects. After that, I may go back to eating slightly lower carbs on off days for the remainder of the cycle, but I haven't made up my mind yet.

Training: I train an upper/lower split 4 days per week focusing largely on compound movements with a couple accessory exercises thrown in at the end. I'm considering adding a 5th day (if I have time) strictly devoted to HIIT cardio, core strength, and lots and lots of calves.

OTC Supps:
Protein Powder
Orange Triad
Oximega fish oil

Some things to note:
- I have arimidex 1mg tabs on hand if needed. I'm thinking of taking 0.25mg eod for a week once I come off the DMZ just to combat any estrogen rebound.
- I know most are gonna say bump the test up to 500mg and run for 8 weeks or it won't be worth it, but I'm determined to run it this way for 6 weeks. I don't want to blow up too fast and have family be all suspect. Plus since this is my first cycle, I'd like to keep it shorter.
- I know I'm young and I should probably wait. Please don't try and talk me out of it.

Any other comments/suggestions are welcome! I'm going to try and update daily with workouts, food, and whatever else comes to mind.

-----------------------------------
NEW CYCLE LAYOUT:

After contemplating the input from some of you more experienced fellas, I've decided to extend this cycle to 10 weeks, maybe even 12 depending on how the gains go and what is going on in my personal life at the time.

So here is the new layout:

Weeks 1-10: Test C 300mg/week
Week 1: DMZ 20mg/day
Weeks 2-4: DMZ 40mg/day

Cycle support: Arimicare pro as directed weeks 1-4

PCT will start 2 weeks after the last pin and will remain the same except I may run clomid for 50mg during the first week instead of 25 since i will be on longer.

Thanks everyone for the input!
 

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I think you have a great plan, but keep in mind just how slow the endocrine system is. The protein systhesis associated with lifting and gear occurs after 21 days. So, you will really be cutting short just how much muscle size increase you could potentually attain by only doing 6 weeks. HOWEVER, for a Test Run, this will suffice. Cant wait to see results.
 
g0hardorgohom

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Looks almost solid, though I'd run the test at 500mg/week for 12+ weeks and DMZ at 40mg/day for 6 weeks.

If you really want to do a 6 weeker use prop instead of cyp. 100mg EOD.
 
TNlifting

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I think you have a great plan, but keep in mind just how slow the endocrine system is. The protein systhesis associated with lifting and gear occurs after 21 days. So, you will really be cutting short just how much muscle size increase you could potentually attain by only doing 6 weeks. HOWEVER, for a Test Run, this will suffice. Cant wait to see results.
Glad to have you aboard! And I know I'm probably short changing myself by only running it for 6 weeks, but since this is my first every cycle, I'd prefer to keep things on the shorter end. Probably a sh1tty excuse, but it is what it is. and i think if I really dial in my diet, I'll be very pleased with the results.
 
TNlifting

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Looks almost solid, though I'd run the test at 500mg/week for 12+ weeks and DMZ at 40mg/day for 6 weeks.

If you really want to do a 6 weeker use prop instead of cyp. 100mg EOD.
Yeah looking back I wish I had picked up some prop, but I bought the test over a year ago and I wasn't thinking about this then. So Test C it is. I'll definitely pick some prop up next time I go to make a purchase though.
 

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No! You're the Darth Vader of your own movie bro. If 6 weeks is all, then do your thing.
 
TNlifting

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No I mean for possible future cycle. I'm keeping this cycle the same layout as the original post
 
g0hardorgohom

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No I mean for possible future cycle. I'm keeping this cycle the same layout as the original post
You should really reconsider it. Stupid cycle like that will probably do more harm than good.
 
g0hardorgohom

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In your opinion, would it be just as stupid to keep the test dosage at 300mg and extend to 8 weeks?
Yes. 10 weeks is the bare minimum and I'd do 12 weeks.
 
TNlifting

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Why do you feel that way? I've heard of and read tons of logs of people who have had success with 8 week cycles
 
rascal14

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Why do you feel that way? I've heard of and read tons of logs of people who have had success with 8 week cycles
Because of the half life of test cyp.

Anything less than 10 weeks use prop. You won't even notice test cyp until week 4 or 5, then you'll be done.
 
g0hardorgohom

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Why do you feel that way? I've heard of and read tons of logs of people who have had success with 8 week cycles
Yeah and I too am doing a 8 weeker as we speak but cyp is not the right ester for it.
 
TNlifting

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Because of the half life of test cyp.

Anything less than 10 weeks use prop. You won't even notice test cyp until week 4 or 5, then you'll be done.
Yeah and I too am doing a 8 weeker as we speak but cyp is not the right ester for it.
I appreciate the advice. I'm aware that prop is more ideal for shorter cycles, but all I have is Test C, and I am unable to get anything different for the time being. Would you guys say there is a big difference in how difficult the recovery process is for short cycles (6-8 weeks) versus longer ones (10-12+ weeks)?
 
g0hardorgohom

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I appreciate the advice. I'm aware that prop is more ideal for shorter cycles, but all I have is Test C, and I am unable to get anything different for the time being. Would you guys say there is a big difference in how difficult the recovery process is for short cycles (6-8 weeks) versus longer ones (10-12+ weeks)?
Just as easy with compounds like test and orals.

When you go past, say, 6 or 12 months, it may be a bit harder.

I've recovered after being on for over 2 years with no problems.

How much of that test you have? Let's plan a better cycle for you together ? Imo even 9 weeks at 200mg/week would be better than 6 weeks at 600.
 
TNlifting

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How much of that test you have? Let's plan a better cycle for you together Imo even 9 weeks at 200mg/week would be better than 6 weeks at 600.
I've got five, 10ml vials of 200mg/ml Test C. I'd like to stay conservative with my doses as I'm just naturally cautious like that hence why I was dosing 300/week.
 
TNlifting

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How's this look?

Week 1-10: Test C 300mg/wk
Week 1-2: dmz 20/day
Week 3-4: dmz 40/day
 
g0hardorgohom

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How's this look?

Week 1-10: Test C 300mg/wk
Week 1-2: dmz 20/day
Week 3-4: dmz 40/day
Better but why not go 12 weeks at once? You could also up the dose to 500 if 300 is not working the way you want it to work.

20mg/day of dmz is pretty much waste of time so I'd up it to 40 from week 2. First week at 20/day just to see how your BP reacts to it.
 
TNlifting

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First Cycle Log: Test C & OL DMZ

Better but why not go 12 weeks at once? You could also up the dose to 500 if 300 is not working the way you want it to work.

20mg/day of dmz is pretty much waste of time so I'd up it to 40 from week 2. First week at 20/day just to see how your BP reacts to it.
Idk I was just under the impression that the longer you are on, the more difficult it will be to bounce back, but if it's really not any different I am open to running it for 12 weeks. My main concern is testicular shrinkage. Don't want the gf to freak out and I don't want to mess with HCG. I was keeping the dose at 300 because I don't want to put on weight too quickly both for joint safety and to avoid looking suspect to my naive family.
 
g0hardorgohom

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Gf won't notice anything
 
TNlifting

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Gf won't notice anything
Well if you insist.

Different question: I know this is largely dependent on how the body responds to the gear, diet, and training, but what is realistic in terms of gains I can expect from running 300mg for 12 weeks plus the 4 week kicker?
 
Nickespo89

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I never suggest multiple compounds for a first time cycle. Simply because you don't know how you even respond to additional test and I would hate for you to be turned off to all anabolic due to a bad experience with a pro hormone. However since you are wanting a kick starter this is how I would suggest going if you are wanting to keep it short.

Don't do less than 10 weeks. First 4 weeks you likely won't even really notice the test in your system. Weeks 6-9 are my "growing weeks".

Weeks 1-10 test c 250x2 per week (500mg total per week)

Week 1 DMZ 20mg to see how your mind and body respond.

Week 2-4 DMZ 20mg 2x a day (if your body and mind have limited negative sides)

Your pct looked solid. Just a heads up there have been cases of people (including me) that had rebound gyno from DMZ. So make sure you have a dopamine agonist available in case...

Also I would add some aromasin 12.5mg e3d. Around week 5 or if you see any estrogen sides prior.
 
TNlifting

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I never suggest multiple compounds for a first time cycle. Simply because you don't know how you even respond to additional test and I would hate for you to be turned off to all anabolic due to a bad experience with a pro hormone. However since you are wanting a kick starter this is how I would suggest going if you are wanting to keep it short.

Don't do less than 10 weeks. First 4 weeks you likely won't even really notice the test in your system. Weeks 6-9 are my "growing weeks".

Weeks 1-10 test c 250x2 per week (500mg total per week)

Week 1 DMZ 20mg to see how your mind and body respond.

Week 2-4 DMZ 20mg 2x a day (if your body and mind have limited negative sides)

Your pct looked solid. Just a heads up there have been cases of people (including me) that had rebound gyno from DMZ. So make sure you have a dopamine agonist available in case...

Also I would add some aromasin 12.5mg e3d. Around week 5 or if you see any estrogen sides prior.
Well thats partially why I wanted to keep the dmz dose at 20. Just to keep potential sides to an absolute minimum. That and TUDCA for liver care is expensive and I wont be buying any more other than what already comes in Arimicare Pro. Also I would rather run the test at 300 for a while and bump it up later if need be than run it 500 right out the gate. I know this probably sounds stupid but thats just what Id prefer. Also in terms of the rebound gyno, why would I need a dopamine agonist? Any gyno from DMZ shouldnt be due to prolactin because it isnt a 19-nor. I have 1mg arimidex tabs on hand that I was planning on taking 0.25mg of every other day for the first week after stopping dmz to protect myself from that. And also to take as needed if I get any estrogen sides from the test.
 
Nickespo89

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DMZ and Sdrol are basically cousins. Both of them have been known to cause rebound gyno. And no one is really sure as to the origin of the cause of it. So I just wanted to you to be aware that there is potential for it. I had to get mine removed surgically. Something I never want another man to go through. And arimicare is great stuff.

Also, it's not stupid to be careful with how you cycle. That being said I would be more cautious about 20mg of any prohormone than I would about 500-750mg of test in the body. Simply because test is naturally produced in the body. It's not a foreign compound so you adapt to it more easily.

Also I am against non suicidal AI's such as Adex. Because there is still the same amount of estrogen in your body. As if you don't take it. Only difference is when you stop taking it your body reactivates any estrogen that hasn't metabolized itself out yet. Aromasin kills Estro the moment it comes into play.

I hope you don't take this as me thinking I know it all. I am only saying these as concerns from the heart. Hoping others can learn from my mistakes and experiences.
 
TNlifting

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DMZ and Sdrol are basically cousins. Both of them have been known to cause rebound gyno. And no one is really sure as to the origin of the cause of it. So I just wanted to you to be aware that there is potential for it. I had to get mine removed surgically. Something I never want another man to go through. And arimicare is great stuff.

Also, it's not stupid to be careful with how you cycle. That being said I would be more cautious about 20mg of any prohormone than I would about 500-750mg of test in the body. Simply because test is naturally produced in the body. It's not a foreign compound so you adapt to it more easily.

Also I am against non suicidal AI's such as Adex. Because there is still the same amount of estrogen in your body. As if you don't take it. Only difference is when you stop taking it your body reactivates any estrogen that hasn't metabolized itself out yet. Aromasin kills Estro the moment it comes into play.

I hope you don't take this as me thinking I know it all. I am only saying these as concerns from the heart. Hoping others can learn from my mistakes and experiences.
I do appreciate the concern, but I believe you are wrong in a couple aspects. Superdrol and DMZ are not prohormones. They are already active, so they are more accurately termed designer steroids. They are also DHT derived steroids, which means they cannot convert to estrogen while you are taking them, BUT when taken standalone they often cause rebound gyno due to your natural testosterone being supressed which in turn leads your testosterone to estrogen ratio being out of whack. Now I could be wrong, but I believe this is why people who run DMZ and Superdrol solo often get rebound gyno. In theory, since I am running it with exogenous testosterone this should be a non issue, but I would rather be safe than sorry which is why I was planning on using the low dose arimidex for the week following coming off the dmz.

In terms of Arimidex vs. Aromasin, you are correct in that Aromasin has a main advantage of being a suicidal aromatase inhibitor, but if arimidex is tapered off slowly, the possibility of gyno from the circulating estrogen is greatly reduced. By the time I would be completely tapered off of the arimidex, my PCT would be far enough under way that my natural test levels should be high enough where this isnt an issue at all.

Again I do appreciate your concerns! And anyone feel free to correct me if I am wrong
 
rascal14

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Don't be worried about getting "too big" it won't happen with one cycle. If there's any questions just say you have been working with a trainer or you just started eating more. Those same naive people will think that's the cause if you tell them it is.
 
TNlifting

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Don't be worried about getting "too big" it won't happen with one cycle. If there's any questions just say you have been working with a trainer or you just started eating more. Those same naive people will think that's the cause if you tell them it is.
Thats not a bad idea. I can see the conversation now..

Mom: "Wow, TNlifting you sure are a lot bigger than when I saw you last month. Hope you arent taking dat der cell tech. Bb.com told me it was bad and its what killed barry bonds."
Me: "Nah mom, I just started working out with a friend at the gym who really know what hes doing and been eating a lot more. You always told me I was too skinny anyways. Besides you know Barry Bonds is still alive right? Anyways, natty gainz for the win mom!"
 

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I agree, too. 300 per week is a rather low dose, so going 10 weeks will help you eek out all you can while minimizing the sides. The goal of every cycle: Least amount of side effects, optimize gains.
 
netflixNchill

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350mg a week for 10 weeks is perfect. Use the dmz as you wish
 
TNlifting

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Thanks for the advice everyone. I think I will be extending the cycle to 10 weeks and maybe 12 depending on how i feel my progress has gone. I've also picked my start date to be January 2nd.
 
netflixNchill

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Don't forget to wait 2 weeks after last injection to pct
 
Dma378

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First Cycle Log: Test C & OL DMZ

Good luck coming off in 6 weeks. Just when the going gets good, you're gonna be like, "FU*K I wish I had another vial!!"

Also didn't see if it had been addressed before, but 3 weeks of DMZ isn't going to do much either.

I realize you are trying to keep things on the DL, but bro you're going to have to come to terms with what you're doing, what you know, and realize that most people don't know shiit about what we do. And screw them and their opinions. You already workout and look like you workout, there will be small noticeable changes to some people but mostly to yourself. Maybe some more vascularity in arms where people will notice, but it's not like you're going gear crazy and gonna look like an inhuman beast. 10-15 pounds comes and goes from me without a second thought from anybody.

Edit: Missed the post where you are extending cycle. Good choice
 
TNlifting

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Good luck coming off in 6 weeks. Just when the going gets good, you're gonna be like, "FU*K I wish I had another vial!!"

Also didn't see if it had been addressed before, but 3 weeks of DMZ isn't going to do much either.

I realize you are trying to keep things on the DL, but bro you're going to have to come to terms with what you're doing, what you know, and realize that most people don't know shiit about what we do. And screw them and their opinions. You already workout and look like you workout, there will be small noticeable changes to some people but mostly to yourself. Maybe some more vascularity in arms where people will notice, but it's not like you're going gear crazy and gonna look like an inhuman beast. 10-15 pounds comes and goes from me without a second thought from anybody.

Edit: Missed the post where you are extending cycle. Good choice
Cool, it's good to hear from someone else's personal experience that most people won't really notice anything drastic and if they do, it sounds like they don't question it. And yeah I've decided to run it at least 10 weeks, maybe 12. I guess I should go back and edit the original post lol
 
Dma378

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First Cycle Log: Test C & OL DMZ

Cool, it's good to hear from someone else's personal experience that most people won't really notice anything drastic and if they do, it sounds like they don't question it. And yeah I've decided to run it at least 10 weeks, maybe 12. I guess I should go back and edit the original post lol
I mean don't get me wrong, if you put a pic of me from 4 years ago next to a pic of me today, it's going to raise some eyebrows.

But yeah the 10lb changes here and there are more seen by us studying ourselves in the mirror.
 
TNlifting

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But yeah the 10lb changes here and there are more seen by us studying ourselves in the mirror.
Lol. Ok cool.

Also to anyone else, I went back and edited the original post and put my new layout on the bottom.
 
Switchfoot

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I agree. Go ahead and do 6 weeks, but you will look back at this cycle in the future and will have wished you did it longer. Trust me.
Sorry. Failed to see your choosing to extend your cycle. Good choice.
 

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Couldnt agree more! Put on 30lbs during a Ment/HGH/LGD cycle in 10 weeks and people noticed, but they know how hard I train and how depleted I was in the summer, so they just think WOW! He looks great! Not Damn! He's juicing.
 
Switchfoot

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Good luck coming off in 6 weeks. Just when the going gets good, you're gonna be like, "FU*K I wish I had another vial!!"

Also didn't see if it had been addressed before, but 3 weeks of DMZ isn't going to do much either.

I realize you are trying to keep things on the DL, but bro you're going to have to come to terms with what you're doing, what you know, and realize that most people don't know shiit about what we do. And screw them and their opinions. You already workout and look like you workout, there will be small noticeable changes to some people but mostly to yourself. Maybe some more vascularity in arms where people will notice, but it's not like you're going gear crazy and gonna look like an inhuman beast. 10-15 pounds comes and goes from me without a second thought from anybody.

Edit: Missed the post where you are extending cycle. Good choice
Good point. Well said!
 
TNlifting

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Alright, 3 days until cycle starts. I'm getting super excited. Should have pics up within the next few days.
 

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How long does it take to affect the endocrine system? Or is this going to be like Dbol and immediate gains? Does it feel like pre workout?
 
TNlifting

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How long does it take to affect the endocrine system? Or is this going to be like Dbol and immediate gains? Does it feel like pre workout?
I have no clue as this is my first ever cycle, but I'm pretty sure it takes about a week or two to really kick in if I remember correctly
 
TNlifting

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Alright decided to just say **** it and take my first pin tonight. 0.75ml to my right glute with a 21g 1.5 incher. Not gonna lie I was pretty nervous. Needle moved around a bit while in me and I pinned it waaaay to fast. Like only a couple seconds. I got almost immediate pip which lasted about 30 minutes or so. Is this normal for virgin muscle? Or is it likely due to my below average injection technique? No swelling or redness. Bled just a couple drops. It just feels kinda like a bruise right now. I'll update in the morning. Apologies in advance for the noob paranoia lol.
 

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21 gauge!! Wow. I like 25, so welcome to being a pin champ!
 

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