Super Mandro/Letrone: Weekly reports.

[gagandugan]

Super Mandro/Letrone: Weekly reports

Hey guys,

this is not going to be a regular daily log, but I will post weekly reports of this fairly "minimalist" cycle: Super Mandro (1-Andro)+Letrone for 30 days.

I have never used any anabolics before, went from a tiny 5' 6" 1/2, 130lbs to 165 naturally (and slowly), with hard work, solid diet, and I even managed to drop body fat in the process. I'm 41, the gains are slowing down... that's life I guess. After some time off last month and a half, I managed to cut down on some fat (157 lbs right now after waking), but my mid-section can still improve. The calipers put me around 12.5%, digital scale anywhere between 12.3 and 13.5, so let's just go with 13% for the sake of this report.

Let's see what this simple 30-day cycle can do!

Goal: Recomp. I would like to float around 163-165 year long, but with increased definition - basically, more muscle mass, less fat. My ideal physique is not massive, obviously, I would simply like to look muscular, lean and athletic. Even 160lbs with less body fat would be great for now.

Workout: Full body workout 3 days/week based on Greyskull method. Big, compound exercises with some isolations at the end of a workout. Normally, I don't do much cardio, but to stay as lean as possible and facilitate fat loss I will row and use stationary bike on off days.

Diet: pretty clean, minimal sugar, no soda, no alcohol, eating around maintenance (maybe just slightly over), which for me is around 2200 calories/day. If you have any suggestions, feel free to post them here!

Staples: Protein powder, Creatine, Multivitamin, Fish oil.

Preload: Hawthorn Berry.

Cycle: 1-Andro, 330 mg/day for 30 days. Spaced evenly on off days; 2 before morning workout, 1 in the afternoon on workout days (does that even matter?). Letrone, 1 cap/day for 30 days first thing in the morning.

Support: Hawthorn Berry, CoQ10, Milk Thistle.

PCT: 1 box of pharma Tamoxifen for 23 days, 20/10/10/2X10. Natural libido booster with Horny Goat/Maca/Mucuna, 2 caps/day for 30 days.

The cycle started yesterday, have nothing special to report so far. I took two and half weeks off from lifting, so the workout was great. Drinking a lot of water and green tea, going to the restroom more than usual.


I hope this log/report is something that will interest you guys.

 

[Jebrook]

In this!

 

[mixedup]

In here looks good

 

[vujade]

Subbed

 

[gagandugan]

Alright, today is Sunday, so it's time for my first weekly report.

I had three full body workouts and three cardio sessions. I can't say I really "felt" the effects of 1-Andro and Letrone, but the workouts were great, I was motivated and the energy level was high. Even cardio, which I normally don't like at all, did not bother me. The pump was excellent. In fact, I got great leg pump yesterday while doing cardio on an ergometer (rower). I increased all my upper body lifts by 2.5 lbs using microplates and lower body lifts by 5 lbs.

Start weight: 157.3
Week #1 weight: 159.5

Honestly, I'm not sure where that extra weight is coming from already. I said I would eat at maintenance, maybe slightly over, but if anything I was slightly under on my cardio days, since this heat and humidity pretty much killed my appetite and my dinners were very light.

Sides: none whatsoever. Blood pressure was 121/78, no headaches or anything. If it wasn't for this heat, I'd feel absolutely fantastic.

 

[abformulations]

I'm in.

 

[gagandugan]

Thank you for following guys. I am really interested to see what this little stack can do. If I like the results, I could extend the cycle to six weeks... we'll see. Maybe goodvibes will be interested to read this. :cheers:

 

[goodvibes]

Thank you for following guys. I am really interested to see what this little stack can do. If I like the results, I could extend the cycle to six weeks... we'll see. Maybe goodvibes will be interested to read this. :cheers:

Most definitely! If you like it go 8 weeks though. That extra 2 weeks at the end means a lot. Besides 1andro solo is mild you'll be alright. Letrone is interesting I might use it for trest this winter

 

[Jebrook]

Most definitely! If you like it go 8 weeks though. That extra 2 weeks at the end means a lot. Besides 1andro solo is mild you'll be alright. Letrone is interesting I might use it for trest this winter

^^^I agree. Go for at least 6 weeks. It is very mild. I gained 4 lbs and dropped about 1% body fat in 4 weeks on 130mg 1-Andro. Triple that dose for 6 weeks would yield some nice gains. If your feeling good at week 6 then keep it going for 8.

 

[mixedup]

Since these aren't liver toxic I'd extend as long as you feel good longer cycles equal more maintainable gains

 

[gagandugan]

Good advice, thank you. I will order one more bottle of Mandro. Letrone has 60 caps anyway, should be enough for now.

Quick edit: I jumped on the SSS sale (-10%) and got another bottle of Super Mandro. Since you all agree about this, I will go for 6 weeks and then re-evaluate; maybe change Letrone protocol to 5 on, 2 off (30 caps total). If I decide to stop there, an additional bottle of Super Mandro plus the leftover would give me another 45-day cycle down the line.

 

[goodvibes]

If this is your first anabolics then you should get some gains on this. Good luck! I forgot to mention that you might need dermacrine but at 6 weeks you probably won't

 

[KilaCali]

Im in this now to thanks for the Link! I've pretty much started the same as you man started at 130lbs about 10 yrs ago, worked my way up naturally and without weights (pullups/pushups/body weight exercises and variations) to 157, in about 8 months, eventually worked up to 170 where I got stuck for about 2-3 years, finally broke through and got to 192, since then ive been back and fourth from 181 to 196.. cant wait to see your results!

 

[gagandugan]

Another Sunday, another report!

Week #2: While I still don't feel the effects of 1-Andro and Letrone, I can say that my strength is definitely going up. The workouts are great and the energy and motivation are better than ever. I am not using any stimulants or pre-workouts, yet the pump is impressive, to say the least. I am continuing to increase my upper body lifts by 2.5lbs, lower body lifts by 5. The mood is also good and the libido normal.

Start weight (lbs): 157.3. Week #1: 159.5. Week #2: 160.6.

So, my weight is increasing and since I am not giving my body a ton of calories (only around 2100-2200), I am hoping it will have to "dig" into the fat reserves very soon. I have been under maintenance twice (-150 kcal), and over once (+250). Otherwise I was eating at maintenance with very light dinners, consisting of one 12 oz protein shake, one plain Greek yogurt and one egg. This is around 420 kcal and 50 grams of protein.

Sides: 1 acne. I haven't had any in a while, so I was surprised to see it. It went away completely in three days. I guess these supplements are doing something. Blood pressure went up from 121/78 to 123/83. Other than that, everything is good.

Oh yes -- I got another bottle of Super Mandro from SSS, so I am now good for 6 weeks and will have half a bottle left for another 6-week cycle next spring.

 

[goodvibes]

Looks good. Strength gains are a great indicator that my lbm will go up. Maybe not a lot but if the strength is going up it means progress. Hang in there, past the week 2 mark it should start picking up.

I dnt think I mentioned it before but you probably would benefit from dermacrine than letrone alongside supermandro

 

[goodvibes]

If you have no issue with buying another product I'd hop on dermacrine from now til end of cycle

 

[gagandugan]

You know, I thought about Dermacrine before I started the cycle. It's a very solid product. I might get one bottle and start using it weeks 4-6. But right now, there is absolutely no lethargy... in fact, I feel really upbeat and energetic. This is why I started something I called the "minimalist cycle": it is simple, with very few supplements. I wanted to see what 1-Andro can do more or less solo and so far it seems my body is responding well.

 

[ZackD89]

Cool idea for a cycle. I can't help but wonder why you're using Letrone on cycle since 1-Andro doesn't aromatize, though. Seems like it would be better in PCT. Would you mind explaining?

 

[goodvibes]

You know, I thought about Dermacrine before I started the cycle. It's a very solid product. I might get one bottle and start using it weeks 4-6. But right now, there is absolutely no lethargy... in fact, I feel really upbeat and energetic. This is why I started something I called the "minimalist cycle": it is simple, with very few supplements. I wanted to see what 1-Andro can do more or less solo and so far it seems my body is responding well.

Your layout is good, it's nice that you're taking the time in trying to figure out how well one product works for you. I normally stack things and it sucks I dnt knw which one is working. At the end of the day I'm probably wasting money on some products that doesn't work. So yes gj and if you dnt feel lethargic I'd skip dermacrine too. That's another $40 you won't need.

 

[gagandugan]

Cool idea for a cycle. I can't help but wonder why you're using Letrone on cycle since 1-Andro doesn't aromatize, though. Seems like it would be better in PCT. Would you mind explaining?

These are all great questions. I am using Letrone because it is a new product, and I was intrigued not so much by its AI properties, but its anabolic/GH potential. I figured that it certainly won't do any harm using 1 cap on a 5 days on/2 days off protocol. I am also susceptible to estrogenic effects, and any time you play with your hormones, stuff can happen - even if the main component (in this case, 1-Andro) does not aromatize. Ostarine does not aromatize either and it made my chest itch like there was low-voltage electricity going through it.

Finally, I am not a big fan of AI in PCT; this topic is always open for debate. I think it's better to use it on cycle if it is used at all. If 1-Andro does not aromatize, and my test levels are suppressed, my estro levels will not be high and therefore there is no need for me to push it even lower - damaging my lipid profile and driving my libido into the ground. If I need something to deal with estrogen rebound later (which is very unlikely), I have Exemestane for that.

I guess one could make an argument for using Letrone at 1 cap throughout, since it is a natural supplement and it does not cause any joint pain. BLR guys are certainly welcome to contribute to the discussion: use it on cycle (with or without aromatizing compounds), during PCT, or both - and why?

 

[gagandugan]

Report #4:

I know it's Saturday, but let's do another report today. Why? Because this week sucked. Big time. And that doesn't have anything to do with the products I'm taking. I had another great workout on Monday, increased my lifts again. Unfortunately, the AC vent was blowing right into my sweaty neck, so I woke up the next morning with an extremely painful case of stiff neck. Wasn't able to turn my head at all.The worst thing is that I wasn't able to get much sleep either. Probably only around 3-4 hours of sleep for three consecutive nights. I had to cancel two cardio sessions and one weightlifting session because of this.

I had to apply some heating neck pads, take Ibuprofen to reduce the inflammation and by Friday I felt OK. Not great, but good enough to go to the gym and do a 50-minute pump session with light weights. I prefer barbell workouts, but this time I used light dumbells and cables. It was a nice change of pace actually. Did not hit back/neck this time for obvious reasons, just legs/chest/arms. I feel even better today, so I am going to continue with my regular barbell workouts next week.

In the meantime, here are some numbers for this week:

Start weight (lbs): 157.3. Week #1: 159.5. Week #2: 160.6, Week#3: 160.8.

I gained 3.5 lbs in three weeks, but this is now slowing down significantly because I am still eating at maintenance. What would you do now: increase calories just a little bit, say by 200-300, or stay with around 2200 and see if that will make some changes in body composition over the next three weeks? All opinions are welcome, as always.

Finally, sides for week #3: none. No acne, libido is great, mood is good (especially considering how much pain I was in recently), no lethargy or anything. The average blood pressure reading for this week was 123/82, it's quite stable at this point.

 

[goodvibes]

Id choose to go one way or the other. Straight cut or bulk. For me doing a recomp is difficult, I have to either lean on one side or the other.

 

[gagandugan]

I hear you. It doesn't seem I am gaining any fat, which is great, but 1-Andro seems to be a good first-time PH for a lean bulk... because this is how my weight gain looks like so far -- an extremely lean bulk. If I increase my calories only slightly, this will probably make me gain about 6-8 lbs in 6 weeks. Which would be alright actually, since it is definitely helping me get stronger. But if I go with that, I will just have to do a small cut later this year.

Guess that means adding two slices of cheese and a small can of fish to my meals. Should be easy.

 

[goodvibes]

Yup just go for the bulk man. Then when you cut make sure you hold on to as much muscle as you can

 

[Doctoroctober]

Subbed! Nice to see fellow 5'-6.x"ers here.

 

[gagandugan]

Doctoroctober goodvibes ZackD89 Jebrook mixedup vujade KilaCali halfhuman

The reason why I am tagging you guys is that this is the end of what I originally planned for the cycle: 4 weeks of 1-Andro and Letrone. I have 6 more caps left, and the bottle of Super Mandro is finished.

This week was awesome! The effects of 1-Andro and Letrone are clearly visible. Here are some of them:

Letrone: keeps me fairly lean and dry. Increases hunger (not always great for those trying to cut or recomp, but hey...). Makes me go to the restroom more often. Gives good pump in the gym - except if this is from 1-Andro. Does it actually lower estrogen? I don't know, since I have no blood work to show. But the above effects are quite pronounced now.

Super Mandro: increases strength, which is now very noticeable. Stimulates weight gain. This is not a cutter! Does not seem to actively burn fat, but I did not lose any definition at all. We'll do a body fat % check in two weeks for the final review of the product. Gives good pump in the gym - except if this is from Letrone.

Maybe surprisingly, for people who are looking a short, lean bulk and whose first priority is training for strength, 30 day of Super Mandro is quite good, and it's a fairly cheap cycle as well. I would suggest not going overboard on calories, because this will not save you from getting fat. A tiny surplus in weeks 3-4 is all that's needed. Some of the food I used to add ~200 calories: two spoons of peanut butter, a boiled egg or two, a small can of tuna, a handful of tree nuts, sliced meat and swiss cheese rolls. Any combination of these and a switch from skim milk to 2% will do the job.

Weight gain recap: Start weight (lbs): 157.3. Week #1: 159.5. Week #2: 160.6, Week#3: 160.8, Week #4, 161.4.

That's 4.1 lbs in 4 weeks with only two weeks of small caloric surplus. I increased all my compound lifts. This week was great because I felt like I could go for a double increase. Decided not to do it, because I am afraid of getting injured, which is a sure way to ruin all the hard work in the gym. But yes, the strength gain is noticeable from 1-Andro. I can honestly say I've never felt stronger.

Sides: none this week. None of the dreaded lethargy, but then I don't have to work over the summer, so I have plenty of time to rest, eat and sleep. Blood pressure average reading for the week was 122/80. No acne. Just have to pee more than usual, but I think that's totally normal for Letrone. I think the libido might be down slightly, but only very slightly.

In conclusion, I will do two more weeks and see if if's worth finishing the second bottle and going for eight weeks, since the compound seems to be very mild, at least for me. If not, I'll save the rest for the next cycle, where I might stack 1-Andro with something like Epiandro, and I will explain why soon.

 

[Jebrook]

Very nice results for a short mild cycle! Hopefully the next two weeks will continue the positive results. Great update and feedback. Thanks bro.

 

[vujade]

Sweet bro. Nice results. Letrone definitely keeps you lean and dry. plus its anabolic & i know
i felt pumped on it as well.

Thx for the feedback. Do you plan on running Letrone any longer...?

If not, can you do review..?

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/product-review/270651-letrone-60-caps.html

 

[gagandugan]

Thanks for the feedback!

Yes, I enjoy writing reviews, and there will be one for Letrone, as soon as I use 30 caps. Since I take five caps a week (5 on, 2 off protocol), I will have used half a bottle at the end of week 6. This is enough to write a good and fair review IMO.

 

[abformulations]

Thanx for the feedback. Glad you enjoyed it and it all went well.

Yea IMO Letrone is better suited for a bulk or recomp. Won't use it during a cut unless it alongside some thing that suppresses appetite. Good job sir

 

[goodvibes]

Gj! That is some great progress for a short cycle. You should definitely extend it so you dnt waste your pct

 

[demonfox]

I'm a bit too late but I'll follow along for the rest of the cycle

 

[bigguyn10ec]

subbed

 

[gagandugan]

Thank you for subbing; I'll be back tomorrow with another report! :wavey:

 

[gagandugan]

Here's another report:

Week #5; strength gains are pretty impressive. Bench press, rack pull, barbell row, squat - they are all going up consistently. I'm glad I still don't feel any lethargy, but I can now say that my libido is definitely down. I can still, uh... "perform" just fine, but the desire is simply not what it used to be. I guess that's normal, and since I have only one more week on cycle, that should not be a problem.

Weight gain recap: Start weight (lbs): 157.3. Week #1: 159.5. Week #2: 160.6, Week#3: 160.8, Week #4, 161.4, Week #5, 162.0.

As you can see, the weight gain is still slow and steady with a small 200 calorie sufficit. Interestingly enough, this is all quality mass; it doesn't seem like I am gaining any fat. My muscles are harder, look fuller and the midsection is not showing any real change. In fact, it might look a little better, but maybe that's in my head. We'll do a body fat % test next week and see if there's any real change.

Sides: blood pressure is up. The average reading for this week was 128/85, but this is nothing to be worried about. Other than that and lowered libido, there are no big sides.

It seems it would be smart to stop after Week 6 and post my final review. I'll save half of the Super Mandro bottle, buy another one soon, and do another 6-week cycle next year.

 

[gagandugan]

#6, end cycle, review.

Doctoroctober goodvibes ZackD89 Jebrook mixedup vujade KilaCali halfhuman

Final update!

We are pretty much done at this point. The cycle is actually 45 days long, so I have three more days of Super Mandro, but there won't be any big changes, I'm sure. Let's see what happened at the end of week 6:

Weight gain recap: Start weight (lbs): 157.3. Week #6, 163.8. Result: +6.5 lbs (+3 kg)

Body fat %: Start: 13% (0.13*157.5= 20.5). Week #6: scale - 11.8-13.1%; caliper method: 12.2. So, let's say 12.5% at the end of the cycle (0.125*163.8=20.5). Interestingly enough - and the mirror confirms this - I did not lose any body fat, but I did not gain any either! It's 6.5 lbs of muscle/water etc. I look like a slightly fuller, stronger version of myself.

Sides (recap): 1 acne at the beginning of the cycle, no problems afterwards. Blood pressure was pretty stable. Slight increase in week 5, went down to 125/80 in week 6. Natural supplements definitely help here. Libido was good for the first four weeks and decreased slightly in weeks 5 and 6. I felt more sleepy and tired in week 6, but I just started working after my summer break, so it might be that... I'm not sure.

Positive effects: slow and steady weight gain, increased appetite, good pump, strength increase.

My goal now will be to PCT for 30 days, let my body recover fully until January and then cut to about 9-10% body fat. I have some plans for this, but more about that later. Here's a review of the products:

Super Mandro: I really like this. The price is good, the dosage is solid and the product is obviously effective. IMO, 1-Andro is either underrated, or perhaps I just respond to it well. Alternatively, maybe this simply works very well for people who have never used PHs before and trained naturally. To me, this looks like a pure bulker and needs to be "controlled" if one doesn't want to get fat. I know those university reports say +8 lbs in one month with 4 lbs of fat loss, but... forget about it. I don't see how this promotes any fat loss. What it does promote is quality mass gains and strength. I can see people using this for 30 days only, eating at maintenance if their priority is gaining strength, breaking plateau(s) and gaining minimal weight. Otherwise, go for 6-8 weeks (1.5-2 bottles) if you don't feel lethargic (I didn't, until the very end), increase your calories by about 300 and enjoy quality gains. To be honest, I think 1-Andro needs to be stacked with something. If you want to go on a lean bulk, a natural AI definitely helps, but epiandro or Cardarine would probably work well too. Otherwise, stack with 4-Andro and an AI and go for a real bulk.

Letrone: Gives good pump, definitely increases appetite, yet keeps you dry and fairly lean in a small surplus. 5 days on, 2 days off protocol works and you end up using half bottle for a 6 week cycle, making it cost-effective too. You get no joint issues this way, no sides whatsoever, but it will make you go to the restroom more, which is a good thing in my book. Thumbs up BLR! Will post an official review later.

Now, here is my question for more experienced people: I am going to cut in early 2016 with the goal to preserve as much muscle as possible while burning fat and getting more "ripped". I have some supplements to help with this; what do you think about these options and what can I expect with a 300 kcal for a week, then 500 calorie deficit the rest of the way, reducing mostly carbs --

Option #1: low dose Ostarine (10mg, to preserve muscle), Norcodrene (appetite suppression), Exotherm (topical fat loss) for 6 weeks. Natural PCT afterward.

Option #2: 30 days, but a much stronger compound - methylstenbolone. Some guys here say it is great for cutting, strength gains are impressive and it will promote fat loss somewhat. Medium dose Msten stacked with Dermacrine and Ar1macare Pro (new formula) for a month, tamoxifen and Sup3r PCT after.

Thoughs on this and my 1-Andro+Letrone cycle? I will update this log at the end of PCT. Thank you for subbing, I really appreciate it!

 

[Jebrook]

gagandugan very nice log and review! Great results as well. I'm glad you enjoyed the run.

 

[mixedup]

Nice recap. Imo with all the people I work with cut is gonna be mostly about diet... and I don't like a cut less than 12 weeks...

I am currently on endurashred. Nutriverse has a 2 bottle combo.

Good for 90 days of Ostarine 20mg gw 14mg ed.

More than enuff to maintain lbm and cut down a couple % bf

Question though you getting ripped for event wedding vacation etc or trying to stay lean all year round that would effect my diet and time recommendations

 

[gagandugan]

Trying to stay lean year long. Thanks for the advice! I can cut for longer, and start with no supplements except my staples. I am also willing to modify my diet and do whatever is necessary to meet this goal.

 

[goodvibes]

First off great progress! Msten you would want to use for a bulk not cutting. Osta with fat burners is a much better option for cutting. Throw in dermacrine and you'll be golden.

 

[abformulations]

Amazing final review and even more amazing run. Gaining muscle wit no increase in bf is great. Thanx for the feedback buddy.

 

[vujade]

gugandugan

Congrats on a successful cycle bro. Enjoyed the log and thx for the Mini review on Letrone.
it really is a great OTC AI with anabolic properties. And you definitely feel good on it.

I'd go the Osta route for the cut, and maybe add some EpiAndro in to assist with Libido and
also to help harden you up. Throw in some Exotherm for added AI/Fat Burner and you've got
yourself a nice cutting cycle.

Its what Im running currently. Im about 2 weeks into and will be doing it for at least 10 weeks.

 

[gagandugan]

Thanks all. I think I will do six weeks of Ostar1ne/Exotherm/Norcodrene stack. That has to give some results if my diet is in check. I can see how epiandro can help achieve "harder" looking physique and it has some anti-estrogenic properties as well, which can be helpful with ostarine.

QUICK EDIT:

I completely forgot to mention that I increased my bench press, row, OHP by 12.5 lbs, squat and low rack pull (I don't deadlift anymore) by 25 lbs. Also, in addition to tamoxifen and a natural libido booster in my PCT, I will add lecithin granules I just bought on sale at a vitamin shop. I've never used PA, but I figured now would be a good time to give it a try.

 

[mixedup]

When you get closer to your cut pm me we can take a look where your at etc I can help with a basic overview

 

[gagandugan]

Will do. Thanks bro!

 

[bigguyn10ec]

Hell of a recap. Great log. Love the details.
Have you thought of ostarine and s4 or s4 and lgd. I have heard those two are sweet

 

[ZackD89]

Fantastic concluding post! Inspirational. Has me excited for my upcoming Super Mandro and Andro the Giant Run (starting next week).

I think you'd enjoy an Osta run for your cut, although at a dose more like 15-20 mg per day. I like mixedup 's suggestion of running EnduraShred.

 

[gagandugan]

I am glad you enjoyed the log. I'll do more next year: SARM-based and PH. I just jumped on the Nutriverse's Tr1umph sale, and that also works extremely well for cutting or recomping. Needs pretty serious on-cycle support though. Zack -- good luck with your 1-Andro run. Tag me when and if you start your log -- I'll follow for sure.

bigguyn10ec: I do have some experience with Ostarine; you can read my detailed review of OL Ostar1ne on Anabolic Minds. LGD -- I did some research and it's a great compound for strength gains and lean bulk or recomp. In fact, I would expect 5-10 mg of Ligandrol ED for six weeks to treat me just like Super Mandro, more or less. S4 - I don't see myself using it, since I already have vision problems and don't need to make my eyesight potentially worse. From what I've read (and I've read a lot) it does result in some serious strength gains, but I'll pass.

 

[chrys]

Excellent review!! Do you use (or have to) serm on your pct for 1-Andro? thanks!

 

[gagandugan]

Thank you! Yes, chrys, I am currently using Tamoxifen, stacked with 2 caps of a natural libido booster. In fact, I have approximately one more week on tamoxifen at 10mg, so I might as well update this log now in the middle of my PCT.

The recovery is going great. I truly feel terrific! No sides at all; blood pressure is normal, libido is terrific, there is no lethargy or anything close to that. The only downside is that I don't have that killer focus and the intense desire to lift weights as I did on 1-Andro. I still work out and feel motivated, of course, but it's not exactly the same. Now I know why some people talk about the "on-cycle feeling". I never understood that, but I think I can see it now.

It seems that 1-Andro is a very mild compound, at least that's how I feel. I'm almost positive I could quickly recover from this product with a high quality natural PCT, but again... why risk it when I have a pharma grade SERM, right?

Another thing: I started losing some water during my first week of PCT, on 20mg of tamoxifen. It made me urinate very frequently. I lost about 0.9 lbs, but the measurements are exactly the same. It is much better on 10mg. Does anyone else have a similar experience? Also, my lifts are still strong. I lost 1 rep on parallel squat and 1 on barbell row. That's it. So far, so good. Will update in a week to 10 days.