AAS, PH, and creatine
- 02-27-2003, 07:07 PM
AAS, PH, and creatine
Didn't know where to put this, since it's about supplements, prohoes, and juice. I was wonderin...
For AAS, creatine is always used post cycle, I'm guessing to maintain some level of muscle hydration, ATP protein synthesis, and of course positive nitrogen levels. (correct me if I'm off).
Now, for PH, I plan on doing the samething...using it during the off cycle, as in, between the cycles. I plan starting on March 1st, PH 4 weeks, off 4 weeks, and from may 1st go on a AAS cycle for 10.
My question is, creatine by itself (given you have fresh receptors), is very effective, and can definitely benefit any lift and make bulking easier. It also seems perfect to this OFF a cycle, since while doing it with a cycle might increase gains, there is too much of a crash and discrepancy post cycle. So, why not space it out right? I thought this is the logical reason for when to use creatine for frequent PH/AAS cyclers.
So this makes me wonder, is there anything other supplement that can do this? Meaning, use for the time in between cycles...that has no adverse effects, and that is not suppressive in and of itself. Could someone conceivably do a PH cycle, then fina, then hard AAS? Or the other way around?
I'm asking if anyone knows about any drug, or any combination, that lets you just stay on virtually for the rest of your life ...that's as good as creatine, and not herbal like tribulus or candyass like glutamine. (j/k)
(okay, fine, not all your life, but as much as possible annually until you're 60. also, is there any point to do PH again after AAS finances notwithstanding?)
- 02-27-2003, 07:10 PM
All anabolic steriods are synthetic compounds whose structure is similar to that of the natural male sex horomone
testosterone. Testosterone affects development of the male body in two important ways: it has an anabolic effect-increased growth, expecially of muscular and skeletal tissue and an androgenic effect-increased development of mail sexual characteristics. Once taken into the bloodstream, anabolic steriods bind to hormone receptonrs on skeletal muscle and other cells and stimulate synthesis of certain specific enzymes. These enzymes promote two improtant biochemical reactions: creatine phoshate systesis and protein sythesis. Creatine phospate is a molecule that can be metabolized in the absense of sufficient oxygen as a shot-term source of energy. Increased creatine phospate synthesis thus allows athletes to train harders and for longer periods of time, and therefore build more muscle. Protien synthesis is essential for long-term development of increased muscle mass or "bulk". In addtion, anabolic steriods promote nitrogen retention by the body. By allowing for better utization of the nitrogen in ingested protein, anabolic steriods help athlets to build mass. However this effect is offset by the bodys homeostatic mechanisms, which are designed to maintain a stable environment: therefore in order to increase body mas by using anabolic steriods, athletes must also adhere to a diet with suffiecent protein and calories - up to 10,000 calories daily with 300 to 400 grams of protein.
Question: Creatine synthesis, if you increase creatine intake while on AS will it help you get stronger. I had always thought it just added to the amount of water you retain ?
Although creatine does have testosterone-like effects,it doesn't act as a steroid hormone.Instead,it's a mediator of some of the
androgens' anabolic effects.In fact,steroid users get far more out
of their cycles if they take in massive amounts of creatine along
with the drugs.Androgens are among the hormones that can force the entry of creatine into muscle cells.While there's a clear
relationship between muscle strength gains and increases in muscle creatine stores,unfortunately,the relationship is not as obvious when it comes to increases in muscle mass.Animal-based studies have shown that the muscles of untrained rats take up as much creatine as the muscles of trained rats,but the ANABOLIC effects of creatine are only obvious in trained rats.Therefore,training increases the muscles sensitivity to the anabolic actions of creatine.(Although it's not related to this article,the study also demonstrated that the anabolic effects of creatine are DIRECT,and not mediated by waterretention.In fact,in the 1970s American and Russian studies pointed out a DIRECT anabolic effect of creatine on muscle cells.)Testosterone increases the muscles'sensitivity to the anabolic properties of creatine in addition to enhancing the creatine buildup in muscle fibers.It's also obvious that part of the strength gains people experience while on steroids are mediated by an increase in muscle creatine stores.An interesting discovery A/S users have made is that they should dramatically increase their creatine intake during a cycle to boost the potency of the steroids.Thanks to creatine,people can build more muscle mass with fewer drugs.Anecdotal evidence from A/S users points out that it
takes at least 10-15 grams(maintenance)of creatine a day to visibly enhance the the anabolic potency of a steroid stack.There are probably good reasons for the increased creatine requirement when androgen levels are high.As mentioned above,steroids increase the muscle uptake of creatine,and if the muscles are ready to accept more creatine,why not give it to them?I also think that even though steroids enhance creatine synthesis,they may increase creatine degradation as well-so more creatine is used up every day.That could be due to an increase in muscle creatine turnover and also the fact
that an elevated muscle protein synthesis rate will likely consume creatine at a faster rate.Other reasons for a higher creatine requirement may be indirect.Because the muscles of drug users are stronger and receive more training,they may waste greater amounts of creatine during training.Once inside the muscle,creatine provides not only an anabolic effect,but also a rapidly mobilized source of fuel.Muscle protein synthesis is a process that wastes great amounts of energy.Anabolism is an ATP-dependent process,which means that it's essential for protein synthesis.If the cellular level of ATP is reduced even a little,IT STOPS ANABOLISM.So even if you can increase the testosterone content of your muscles,nothing will happen if your ATP level is low.Creatine supports anabolism by providing energy to the muscle...
- 07-26-2004, 04:47 PM
10,000 calories a day while on gear?! What nonesense! Ronnie Coleman himself--with the hear he has accessto--couldn't use that many calories synthezise protein! c'mon; wake up!
09-16-2006, 09:47 PM
im on a cycle of pro magnon 25 right now and was wondering after i finish this cycle can i go straight into a cyle of another ph or how long should i wait?
09-16-2006, 11:03 PM
09-17-2006, 03:35 AM
09-17-2006, 11:02 AM
- Join Date
- May 2003
- Rep Power
- Lv. Percent
Peyton,Originally Posted by peyton
This is NOT BB.com. You will be laughed at for something so juvenile. If your cycle was 4 weeks, take a 8 off.
You need to read until one of the Bush Daughters is president BEFORE posting again.
My The 1 LOG: http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/254164-my-one-log.html
09-23-2006, 10:22 AM
I actually feel dumber for reading this...
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