First PH Cycle! HAVOC
- 06-20-2013, 05:52 PM
First PH Cycle! HAVOC
First off, apologies for not being an active member on this website just a long time lurker here.. Anyways after about a year of research I've decided to pull the trigger on my first PH cycle: Epistane. Here are some details and feel free to critique. Otherwise join for the ride
RPN Havoc 30/30/40/40/40
CEL Cycle Assist
Fish Oil (throughout)
Whey Protein (throughout)
Opti-Men Multi-Vit (throughout)
PES Erase 0/3/3/3/3
Purus Labs Organ Shield
I think I have all the bases covered and I will elaborate on nutritional info as well as a workout routine after the products arrive!
- 06-21-2013, 08:17 PM
- 06-23-2013, 06:53 AM
I ran an epi cycle and logged it.
I'd say that a week at 20 is a waste, too low. I'd start at 30.
Also 4 weeks is too short. You won't see anything or barely anything until 2-3 weeks from starting
06-24-2013, 04:50 PM
06-24-2013, 05:26 PM
06-24-2013, 06:15 PM
06-24-2013, 06:17 PM
06-24-2013, 10:00 PM
Like everyone else has said 20 is a low dose. Start at 30. I went up to 50 and the side effects kicked in pretty bad so more is not always better. Havoc is legit though. I love that stuff.
06-25-2013, 01:11 PM
Hey guys so my bottle of Havoc just arrived and I am impatiently waiting to take it. My cycle assist along with the other support sups will be here in 2 days... Do you guys think it would be okay to start my cycle today? I want to start this cycle ASAP and I don't think 2 days without support supps will make a difference but I could be wrong! Anybody?
06-25-2013, 01:56 PM
1. Did you get a serm?
2. Did you get another bottle of havoc?
The danger of starting without having your pct ready in hand is you don't leave yourself an out. If you have to stop and you don't have your pct, you're fkd. Nobody plans on stopping but the unknown may happen.
06-25-2013, 08:11 PM
1. Yes, clomid should be here within the week.
I've decided to wait until everything comes to be safe. I was also wondering if I should go out and buy some milk thistle and hawthorne berry. I already ordered cycle assist and organ shield so I assume that should suffice. Am I wrong?
BTW, cycle starts thursday
06-25-2013, 08:16 PM
06-25-2013, 09:01 PM
I'm in my second week of Havoc and loving it. I'm running 30/30/30/40 and may run an extra week at 40mg. I started at 204lbs and I'm at 209lbs currently. I'm already looking a bit fuller and I get stronger every workout. Had a bit of lethargy and mood swing towards the end of the first week but I feel good now. Make sure you take plenty of fish oil as this stuff makes your joints dry. Also, taurine will help a lot with the back pumps.. I noticed those on back and leg day even the first week.
06-25-2013, 09:04 PM
06-25-2013, 09:13 PM
I've always been prone to a pimple or two randomly appearing on my shoulders or sometimes face. That being said, I haven't noticed a difference since starting. I'm also using N2 shampoo to assist in keeping my hair on my head. Since using it I've noticed even less shedding than prior to my cycle.
06-25-2013, 09:19 PM
You teenagers and your GD pimples. Chill the fk out. Wash your face and enjoy your too many hormones. Don't hear any of y'all complaining of limp dck. Go lift and get psy. Quit crying. Y'all got no troubles
06-25-2013, 09:20 PM
Don't mean to hijack your log but having a hard time starting one I started my havoc cycle today. just a quick question dies anyone think that using muscle meds Carnivore beef protein is a problem due to the natural creatine in it? Any insight would be great and terrific thread man I've been following it
06-25-2013, 10:31 PM
06-26-2013, 07:39 AM
06-27-2013, 08:20 PM
So I'm about to start my cycle but I need a bit of PCT advice. How should I time my clomid, daa, and AI?
06-27-2013, 08:27 PM
06-27-2013, 11:59 PM
Should I even bother easing into the cycle like taking 10 mg the first day 20 the second etc etc? Or dive right into the 30 mg day 1
06-28-2013, 12:39 AM
06-28-2013, 01:02 AM
I started day 1 at 30mg. Also, I was doing legs yesterday and doing an insane drop set on leg press and with 4 reps to go I suddenly developed a bad headache. I think it may have been in part do to improper breathing but I have noticed more frequent headaches while on Havoc. I'm going to get my bp checked asap to make sure it hasn't spiked.
06-28-2013, 06:42 AM
06-29-2013, 05:56 PM
Currently on day 2 and things are going smoothly though I must say I miss PWO.
Also, when does the hunger aspect of Epi start to come into play? I'm shoveling food down my throat and it would surely help if my appetite was higher
06-30-2013, 04:27 PM
You won't feel the need for your PWO after a week or two. Even when I went through the stage of being lethargic I was fine once I actually got in the gym and started lifting. As far as appetite, I've always starved after 2 or 3 hours without eating so I haven't noticed a difference. By the way, all my compound lifts have went up 20 or more pounds so far and I have still have over two weeks left. Going to bump up to 40mg next week. My morning weight is 210 now, up 6 pounds so far.
07-01-2013, 08:27 AM
I've always taken a pwo no matter what I'm on. Just gotta watch blood pressure. Liquid Hawthorne works perfectly for me.
07-03-2013, 01:49 AM
Here's a little update for you guys
I'm currently on my 5th day of the cycle and things have been going great so far. Nothing really happened the first few days other than a bit of lethargy but my workouts have been more intense and I find myself pushing myself harder and harder. As I'm sitting here hours after my workout I could still feel the stiffness of my muscles and I take that as a good thing. I'm confident that my diet and training is on point and I am hoping to see some serious gains in the coming weeks.
Also, what do you guys think about lifting more frequently on cycle?
07-03-2013, 03:21 AM
How many days a week do you workout OP? If you feel like you are recovering fine then go ahead.
What is amazing to me is my jump in strength while on cycle. My bench has gone from 275 to 300. My deadlift has gone from 385 to 425. My squat has also gone from 335 to 365. My weight is up 8 pounds with two weeks left. If I can keep half my total gains I will consider this a successful cycle.
07-05-2013, 01:39 AM
So my liver had quite the workout today in celebration of the 4th, but after today I promised myself that I will not drink anymore on cycle.
Tomorrow marks the end of my first week on cycle and I've already been getting complements left and right. My lethargy has been pretty bad and I experienced my first calf pumps today and they are pretty sh*tty. Anyways I can't wait to get back in the gym... Considering doing 2 a days and ignoring the overtraining hype. I'll see how it goes for a week.
07-05-2013, 09:25 AM
And OP how many grams of taurine are you taking? I'd up your dose if you are getting pumps already. Usually they don't happen until a few weeks into the cycle like week 3.
07-06-2013, 07:21 PM
I think the creatine will be fine, it should not interfere with anything other than a little bit of water retention if anything. Otherwise I think your dosing is fine. I usually take 1-2 grams of taurine a day because I haven't experienced any sort of back pumps yet. I plan on upping my dosage according to how severe they get.
Anyways, week 1 of my cycle is up and the results are definitely noticeable. I started my cycle at 170 lbs and now I'm up to 176.5. No bloat no fat just muscle. My strength has gone up considerably and the side effects have yet to kick in (hoping they don't). At this rate I have very high hopes for the cycle and we'll see how it goes!
07-06-2013, 11:26 PM
You'll always gain a lot in the first week as your body stores excess glycogen in the muscle. And for every gram of glycogen your muscle stores there's 2.7g of water, mostly intracellular. It should balance out from here on out.
07-11-2013, 03:14 AM
Friends, I am having some anxiety about a side effect that I have been experiencing with havoc. For the past few days, my scalp has been itchy and I was wondering what that could mean. Im really hoping that it's not a sign of hairloss. I am not prone to MPB but because of epis androgenic effects, it could be messing with my DHT levels.
I've been seeing great results so far and I would hate to end my cycle early. I'm 2 weeks into this cycle, is it okay to continue another 2 weeks on halodrol instead? (Halo is not androgenic)
07-11-2013, 06:36 AM
DZ, a few posts up you "worked out your liver". We all know there is supposed to be no alcohol consumption while on cycle due to adding to liver stress. I wonder if your scalp dryness is due to dehydration? Alcohol consumption can dehydrate. Are you drinking 1 to 1.5 gallons of water a day?
07-11-2013, 06:43 AM
Dehydration is a possibility. I try to drink as much water as I can but I admit I am not very strict with logging my water consumption.
However, I have read an overwhelming number of posts that suggest that scalp itchiness on epistane is common and almost always due to DHT conversion which leads to hairloss. I am at a crossroad at this point and don't know what to do.
If I do choose to start PCT, I may just do 2 weeks of clomid 50/25. I have not experienced much in terms of shut down but I feel like a serm is always necessary but I could be wrong
07-18-2013, 12:26 AM
So I'm 19 days in and I have definitely made some gains. I am bulking so my diet is in check, I train 5-6 days a week, and I get plenty of rest. I want to ask the veteran Epistane users when they saw the most results because I have high expectations for this product (10-20 lbs).
07-18-2013, 11:16 AM
Awesome to see you stuck with it. I had been following your log because I'm planning on running havoc this fall and the pct/support supps I planned on using we're very similar to yours so I'm very interested to see how the rest of your cycle goes. Just out of curiosity, any reason you chose to use purus labs organ shield during pct instead of just continuing to use CEL cycle assist all the way thru?
07-18-2013, 02:20 PM
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