"gain and keep" cycle; comments?
10-27-2004 10:04 PM
"gain and keep" cycle; comments?
anyone care to comment on this possibility. Goal: to gain for 4 weeks, then clean it up and retain it.
1. 4AD, 1T
2. 4AD, 1T
3. 4AD, 1T, 4OHT, M1T, Letro (as necessarry), E/C
4. 4AD, 1T, 4OHT, M1T, Letro, E/C
5. 1T, 4OHT, Mdien, clen
6. 1T, 4OHT, Mdien, clen
7. 1T, 4OHT, Mdien, E/C
8. 1T, 4OHT, Mdien, E/C
9-14 PCT with Nolva, Trib, etc.
9-10 also would have clen
Liver support throughout: milk thistle, NAC, ALA, CoQ10, Hawthorne (as nec.), potassium, taurine
The other possibility I'm considering is exactly the same, but replace the Mdien with M4OHN.
10-27-2004 11:00 PM
i dont know if 4OHT will negate the bad sides of 1T.. other than that looks solid\
MOHN might offset sides enough, i dont think MD will, although i feel great on it
10-28-2004 12:50 AM
(4AD, 1T, 4OHT all transdermal)
1. 4AD 400mg, 1T 200mg
3. 4AD 400mg, 1T 200mg, 4OHT 200mg, M1T 10mg, letro 1.25 mg EOD if necessarry
4. same as 3
5. 1T 200mg, 4OHT 200mg, Mdien 12mg (or M4OHN 40mg), clen 100-140mg
6-8 same as 5, but 7-8 without the clen. I'll use clen again in PCT (weeks 9-10)
10-28-2004 01:30 AM
Is this your first cycle? If not then i would say maybe add another 50mg 1test and another 100-200mg 4ad.
Youll definately want more 4ad when your running 1test and M1Test together, that will be killer for lethargy, and hey 4ad is dirt cheap
I really like this cycle though, youll really harden up the last 4 weeks with the OHT and Mdein or MOHN, Should make some VERY decent gains!
11-01-2004 12:46 AM
thanks, Kris. I wanted to keep 4AD lower because of bloating last time, but come to think of it, the letro should take care of it. I have done a number of cycles, incidentally. So I could go 600 4AD, 300 1T and use letro or formestane (or kick the 4OHT in) weeks 1-2, then see how that works, adjust as necessarry for weeks 3-4, etc.
I'm leaning towards M4OHN rather than MDien weeks 5-8 just because it appears milder overall.
The other tempting thing would be use M-DHT with 4AD and 1T weeks 1-2 (cause I'm jonesing to try it, and because that should offset bloat too, as opposed to letro or form.
11-01-2004 01:10 AM
I like the M4OHN much better for your cycle.
Originally Posted by milwood
11-10-2004 08:45 PM
I'm in week 1 with 4AD, 1T, 4OHT and M-DHT. Workouts M, W, F. I'll post feedback, but I'm kind of a slacker in terms of documentation of every moment on cycle (props to you guys who are diligent and meticulous; extremely helpful...) .
11-10-2004 09:22 PM
Looks like a good cycle! I'd probably use the M1T in weeks one and two to jumpstart the cycle. Typical wisdom is to take the most aggressive compounds at the beginning of a cycle to allow your body more time to solidify the gains made in following weeks. I think you will really like the 4OHT for clean dry gains. I actually had to reduce the amount I was taking in my current cycle because 1200 mg a week trandermal caused joint pain and the lack of estrogen was reducing my gains.
11-11-2004 03:20 PM
How much MDHT are you taking and what is your dosing regimen?
I agree with uridium about the M1t.
Cant wait to see how this does for you
11-11-2004 05:58 PM
I started at 400 4AD, 200 1T, and 200 4OHT t/d daily, plus 50mg of M-DHT. I wanted to wait on the M1T so the others would kick in, but I seem to be fighting some lethargy already in week 1!!! I didn't even expect to get anything (effects) yet, so maybe I'm getting sick or something. I'm sleeping enough, so I have no idea. Little acne too. I'll up the 4AD to 600 starting today. Does 4OHT potentially cause lethargy like 1T? I thought it would help with the problem. And I certainly don't expect lethargy from M-DHT! I'll see how things go, but I will revise this cycle drastically if it gets painful. I'm not gonna suffer the holidays even if it means less gains for now!!!
11-12-2004 05:02 AM
I've never heard of 4OHT causing it. It certainly didn't effect me that way and it did help with the lethargy from M1T which usually hits me in the first week. Some people respond to 1T trandermal different than other, but you may be getting sick as alot of bugs are floating around right now. When I have used trandermals in the past I usually notice their effects in week one.
11-15-2004 04:31 PM
I had to totally nuke this cycle because of a series of bad reactions and/or a bad bug I seem to have. I've bagged the t/d's and am gonna run a totally dif cycle for a couple weeks to see how things go. I'm running oral 1,4 dione with M-DHT for 6-8 weeks. That's it for now. Everything else goes on the back burner 'tll I figure out what was messing me up.
11-18-2004 09:27 AM
FYI: there's not that much aromatizable hormones in that stack. The 4OHT would be sufficient for AI purposes. Don't waste the letrozole by using it in that stack.
11-20-2004 05:28 PM
M-DHT and 1,4 dione are working; hard and vascular beyond belief, after approx. 1 1/2 weeks only. May be switching to M4OHN and 1,4 for weeks 3-6 or 3-8.
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