CEL stack

[A2Paredes]

I recently bought H-drol and a P-stanz bottle. I have a bottle of each and I plan on doing H-drol for 4 weeks and on the 4th week, i ll stack the P-stanz for 4 weeks. I am going to be taking milk thistle with it while on cycle, fish oil and a multi vitamin. Is that a good enough for me? its my first cycle and I don’t plan doing anymore cycles after this. Also, I might be taking novatest for PCT. Could you tell me how this looks??

 

[mw1]

I recently bought H-drol and a P-stanz bottle. I have a bottle of each and I plan on doing H-drol for 4 weeks and on the 4th week, i ll stack the P-stanz for 4 weeks. I am going to be taking milk thistle with it while on cycle, fish oil and a multi vitamin. Is that a good enough for me? its my first cycle and I don’t plan doing anymore cycles after this. Also, I might be taking novatest for PCT. Could you tell me how this looks??

You will probably need an additional bottle of pstanz. However , if this is your first PH cycle then I would recommend a solo Hdrol cycle. Cycle Assist is a very complete products for your supporting supp needs but I'm not sure what Novatest is that you have for PCT. Who makes it?

 

[A2Paredes]

You will probably need an additional bottle of pstanz. However , if this is your first PH cycle then I would recommend a solo Hdrol cycle. Cycle Assist is a very complete products for your supporting supp needs but I'm not sure what Novatest is that you have for PCT. Who makes it?

Well I want to get big with H-drol and then cut with P-Stanz. I was planning to run 25/50/50/50 for H-drol and 50/100/100/150 for P-stanz. I went to vitamin world to get some information about this because they know me there so I took the bottles there. The guy told me he tried H-drol but not P-stanz. He recommend it the milk thistle and fish oil. He said that with the doses I am going to be taking, I wont be needing Inhibit e and all that. He told me that novatest has estrogen blocker and such. I think novatest is made by Xero limits. What does the cycle assist have?? I appreciate your help.

 

[gaijininjapan]

You can lookup the ingredients on their website or any online store that carries CEL products. IMO, you should be using more than just milk thistle and fish oil... You'll want something for your cholesterol levels and other EFA's like Omega 6 and 9. Sounds like you need some more research. Go ask around inthe Anabolics forum and you should get some good answers.

 

[A2Paredes]

Well thats why I made this post so I can learn more about this, I did lots of research but all I find are threads that are not my situation.. Also, the people talk about many products and I don’t know any of them. Could you guys help out here??

 

[gaijininjapan]

Basically, if you gain fast, you'll also risk losing it fast. To me, it's not a good idea to jump right into vutting after a PH bulk cycle. I would play it safe and take time off equivalent to your total on-cycle + PCT time. Then, jump into a cut once your body is used to the new mass and has made it more of a permanent addition to your body. Throughout the entire time, keep training hard and eating properly.

I would recommend, like others here, a solo HDROL cycle w/ an all-in-one support supplement like cycle assist. Also, get an additional bottle of milk thistle to use for preloading.

As for PCT, I've heard that you don't need a SERM w/ HDROL, so you should be fine with most PCT supplements out there. Check the PCT forum, there should be some programs for HDROL.

I:m taking the following supps while on-cycle right now
CEL cycle assist (recommended bottle dosing)
Liv.52 (recommended bottle dosing)
Red Yeast Rice (1200mg)
EFA Lean (2 servings per day)
multivitamin (recommended bottle dosing)

For PCT, I'll be using CEL's PCT assist, milk thistle, red yeast rice, and a multivitamin.

I am also using creatine the entire time.

 

[GQNemesis]

Firstly .. i dont think your first cycle should be a stack .. i would just do 50mg of halo for 4weeks like suggested above .. but if you are doing a 8week cycle .. your PCT needs upgrading

p-stanz alone at 50-100mg wont do anything esp after you have ran halo for 4 weeks ..so either bridging it into 3rd week ..sounds good

halo - 50/50/50/50
pstanz - 0/0/100/100/150/150

as for the whole milk thistle suggestion .. u should look into more .. if you go to vitamin or gnc thats all they suggest bc thats all they know

Cycle assist offers way more N-Acetyl for liver along with milk thistle .. hawthorne, saw palmetto, b-5 (just to name my favorites)

if you want caps cycle assist, if powder then cycle support .. i would never run a cycle without the two

 

[A2Paredes]

Basically, if you gain fast, you'll also risk losing it fast. To me, it's not a good idea to jump right into vutting after a PH bulk cycle. I would play it safe and take time off equivalent to your total on-cycle + PCT time. Then, jump into a cut once your body is used to the new mass and has made it more of a permanent addition to your body. Throughout the entire time, keep training hard and eating properly.

I would recommend, like others here, a solo HDROL cycle w/ an all-in-one support supplement like cycle assist. Also, get an additional bottle of milk thistle to use for preloading.

As for PCT, I've heard that you don't need a SERM w/ HDROL, so you should be fine with most PCT supplements out there. Check the PCT forum, there should be some programs for HDROL.

I:m taking the following supps while on-cycle right now
CEL cycle assist (recommended bottle dosing)
Liv.52 (recommended bottle dosing)
Red Yeast Rice (1200mg)
EFA Lean (2 servings per day)
multivitamin (recommended bottle dosing)

For PCT, I'll be using CEL's PCT assist, milk thistle, red yeast rice, and a multivitamin.

I am also using creatine the entire time.

Thanks for all this info but I kinda want to do this once and never really do it again because of side effects. Also, I don’t care gaining too much weight, I mean I can do that easier than cutting. At first, I just wanted to cut, its really hard for me but increasing mass is easier. So, you recommend buying CEL’s PCT assist?? and does it work as a PCT? or its just an assist? I appreciate the help.

Firstly .. i dont think your first cycle should be a stack .. i would just do 50mg of halo for 4weeks like suggested above .. but if you are doing a 8week cycle .. your PCT needs upgrading

p-stanz alone at 50-100mg wont do anything esp after you have ran halo for 4 weeks ..so either bridging it into 3rd week ..sounds good

halo - 50/50/50/50
pstanz - 0/0/100/100/150/150

as for the whole milk thistle suggestion .. u should look into more .. if you go to vitamin or gnc thats all they suggest bc thats all they know

Cycle assist offers way more N-Acetyl for liver along with milk thistle .. hawthorne, saw palmetto, b-5 (just to name my favorites)

if you want caps cycle assist, if powder then cycle support .. i would never run a cycle without the two

Should I start with my doses smaller since It would be my first cycle?? Also Cycle assist is like milk thistle? and cycle support is the same? I don’t want to do one cycle with hdrol and then wait like a month and then do another cycle with pstanz. But if its the safest as for my health, I will do that. Also, what age do you guys recommend?

 

[GQNemesis]

Should I start with my doses smaller since It would be my first cycle?? Also Cycle assist is like milk thistle? and cycle support is the same? I don’t want to do one cycle with hdrol and then wait like a month and then do another cycle with pstanz. But if its the safest as for my health, I will do that. Also, what age do you guys recommend?

That is a very small dose bro .. most advance users go up to 100-125mg of halo .. your keeping it at 50(which is perfect ..bc your stacking plus that way one bottle will be sufficent)

Cycle Assist has 60 serving .. i usually take 2servings a day = 30days, which will give you .. 1000mg of Milk Thistle (Standardized to 80% Silymarin)

Cycle Support is the same product by diff. company .. both are great, cycle support is a powder and can ruin your protein drinks, i usually mix it in glass with 1-2oz of water and shotgun it down .. if ure prone to good taste then i would suggest cycleAssist(caps would be easier for you then)

i love both products .. have ran cyclesupport 2 times and cycle assist 1time .. cycle assist i used it in a heavy cycle and was amazed by results(my review is on other forum) .. i wouldnt run a cycle without it .. its best for your health.

Age - i would say 21-22 .. i was 27when i started it .. if your under 21, i would keep gathering info and keep saving up products and run it when you have reached that age .. bc at young age you dont want to mess up your hormone levels

your question regarding PCT Assist - it is best made to used in PCT(after your cycle) yeah i see where you get the confusion with the word "assist"

 

[gaijininjapan]

Thanks for all this info but I kinda want to do this once and never really do it again because of side effects. Also, I don’t care gaining too much weight, I mean I can do that easier than cutting. At first, I just wanted to cut, its really hard for me but increasing mass is easier. So, you recommend buying CEL’s PCT assist?? and does it work as a PCT? or its just an assist? I appreciate the help.

Side effects are not lasting if you do things right. If you're not looking to gain much mass, then don't even bother with PH's. If you're looking to basically cut, then get your diet and training in check, and start w/ some basic fat burners if you need some help. PH's and supplements HELP you progress, wether it's gaining mass, breaking past a plateau, or cutting. However, if you can't do that naturally, especially with your stats, then you have no business looking at PH's.

What's your reasoning behind wanting to use PH's? What's your current training and diet like? What supplements are you currently taking?

 

[A2Paredes]

That is a very small dose bro .. most advance users go up to 100-125mg of halo .. your keeping it at 50(which is perfect ..bc your stacking plus that way one bottle will be sufficent)

Cycle Assist has 60 serving .. i usually take 2servings a day = 30days, which will give you .. 1000mg of Milk Thistle (Standardized to 80% Silymarin)

Cycle Support is the same product by diff. company .. both are great, cycle support is a powder and can ruin your protein drinks, i usually mix it in glass with 1-2oz of water and shotgun it down .. if ure prone to good taste then i would suggest cycleAssist(caps would be easier for you then)

i love both products .. have ran cyclesupport 2 times and cycle assist 1time .. cycle assist i used it in a heavy cycle and was amazed by results(my review is on other forum) .. i wouldnt run a cycle without it .. its best for your health.

Age - i would say 21-22 .. i was 27when i started it .. if your under 21, i would keep gathering info and keep saving up products and run it when you have reached that age .. bc at young age you dont want to mess up your hormone levels

your question regarding PCT Assist - it is best made to used in PCT(after your cycle) yeah i see where you get the confusion with the word "assist"

Yeah my first choice was going with 50 for four weeks but then I got a little scared since I’ll be stacking them. So you think I should do a 7 week stack or a 6 week stack? or I guess just one cycle? Thank you sooo much for the help man.

Side effects are not lasting if you do things right. If you're not looking to gain much mass, then don't even bother with PH's. If you're looking to basically cut, then get your diet and training in check, and start w/ some basic fat burners if you need some help. PH's and supplements HELP you progress, wether it's gaining mass, breaking past a plateau, or cutting. However, if you can't do that naturally, especially with your stats, then you have no business looking at PH's.

What's your reasoning behind wanting to use PH's? What's your current training and diet like? What supplements are you currently taking?

Well im scared of gyno, even tho I think I have gyno and I have never taken any PHs or anything like that. Maybe it was malnutrition or something because I’ve done research and I guess it could happen with malnutrition. I want to gain mass tho.. Last summer I went to the gym Mon-Sat and played soccer Sunday and I didn’t really gain mass. Some people say is too much working out but my body felt good so I just kept going. I haven’t gone to the gym this past week because of college finals and I haven’t been taking much but multivitamin and some protein. When I train tho I take lots of protein. I recently started using creatine and multivitamins. Like 2 weeks ago I tried shotgun too and it felt pretty good. I want to gain muscle, don’t get me wrong, but if I lose some after cycle, i don’t mind. As for cutting, Ive tried hardcore, no pills, just eating lots of low fat food and training everyday. I did card everyday and abs. I got some results but it was miserable. I want to cut the MOST.. ha I just want the super V abs and the ribs. Thanks for helping me man..

 

[bashman]

Abs come last bro, you need to have some decent mass on you, in order to have something left over after you cut the fat. E.g. being 145lbs at 15%bf would be pointless cutting unless you're a chick. Get your diet right, before you start H-Drol. Its not easy putting on muscle, you seriously need to EAT in order to gain.

With bodybuilding its basically "in for a penny in for a pound" either commit to everything properly - which takes a lot of time - or don't bother at all.

Also, when you do run H-Drol I seriosuly recommend running 6 weeks at 50/75/75/75/75/75, as it takes 2 -3 for the PH to kick in. Read as many logs as you can find, at least 95% are running 6 weeks at the suggested dose. 4 weeks at 50/50/50/50 = fail for mass gains especially if you don't have training and diet in order.

If you are gyno prone, I would recommend stacking something like Androhard or Stano-drol - read up on both of them. Don't jump into anything, keep researching, learning, read logs, then make a informed decision. Gl bro

 

[A2Paredes]

Abs come last bro, you need to have some decent mass on you, in order to have something left over after you cut the fat. E.g. being 145lbs at 15%bf would be pointless cutting unless you're a chick. Get your diet right, before you start H-Drol. Its not easy putting on muscle, you seriously need to EAT in order to gain.

With bodybuilding its basically "in for a penny in for a pound" either commit to everything properly - which takes a lot of time - or don't bother at all.

Also, when you do run H-Drol I seriosuly recommend running 6 weeks at 50/75/75/75/75/75, as it takes 2 -3 for the PH to kick in. Read as many logs as you can find, at least 95% are running 6 weeks at the suggested dose. 4 weeks at 50/50/50/50 = fail for mass gains especially if you don't have training and diet in order.

If you are gyno prone, I would recommend stacking something like Androhard or Stano-drol - read up on both of them. Don't jump into anything, keep researching, learning, read logs, then make a informed decision. Gl bro

I know but I feel like I am pretty happy with my arms and chest, I tried cutting this last summer, its really hard for me even tho I did cardio everyday and just ate like chicken breast soup that had lots of veggies in it. I am 18 and going to be 19 in march. Ive seen many peoples comments saying that it can mess your hormone levels so I don’t want to mess that up. I am going to be stacking it with P-stanz which would make it a 6 week or 7 week cycle? Wouldn’t that be good enough. Also, when I get on H-drol cycle, I plan on eating Chipotle, Idk if you guys heard of this place, its amazing food with lots of protein. Thanks for your input bro.

 

[bashman]

S**t sorry bro, did not see your age, stay well away from this stuff until you are atleast 21. Also sounds like you were eating too little and your metabolism probably crashed, hence bad results.

Research about proper nutrition, its the most important part. Its not all about protein, carbs and fats are not bad, infarct they are essential and have their place in every diet.

If you eat, train and sleep right, you could gain so much more mass in the next two years, especially at your age - your primed for building muscle.

 

[A2Paredes]

S**t sorry bro, did not see your age, stay well away from this stuff until you are atleast 21. Also sounds like you were eating too little and your metabolism probably crashed, hence bad results.

Research about proper nutrition, its the most important part. Its not all about protein, carbs and fats are not bad, infarct they are essential and have their place in every diet.

If you eat, train and sleep right, you could gain so much more mass in the next two years, especially at your age - your primed for building muscle.

I also used to eat pasta and oatmeal with protein and a banana in the mornings, but I plan to eat a lot if I do this hdrol cycle.. But I guess I am still not sure if I should do it or not. I always get someone telling me, yes it will be fine, and then someone telling me no don’t do it. I haven’t gained weight in a while and idk why, im kinda stucked for like the past 2 months. I haven’t been that consistent either because of college. If hdrol is too much, should I just take p-stanz at least to cut??

 

[mw1]

S**t sorry bro, did not see your age, stay well away from this stuff until you are atleast 21. Also sounds like you were eating too little and your metabolism probably crashed, hence bad results.

Research about proper nutrition, its the most important part. Its not all about protein, carbs and fats are not bad, infarct they are essential and have their place in every diet.

If you eat, train and sleep right, you could gain so much more mass in the next two years, especially at your age - your primed for building muscle.

Good post

 

[gaijininjapan]

Yeah, didn't know your age earlier, but don't mess w/ PHs til you're at LEAST 21, AND have hit a plateau in your training. If you're gaining progress naturally, then you're fine.

As for gaining mass, you need to eat. When you worked out every day, you burn a lot of calories. While many youngin's THINK they're eating a lot... they're probably not. Healthy foods fill you up faster than junk food. I eat a single large chicken breast and I feel full. Whereas I can eat a double qtr pounder w/ fries and a large coke and feel the same. vastly different nutritional values and calories though. But stay away from fast food if you can.

if you're happy with your arms and chest, I would suggest you do something like the starting strength program, which will help you gain strength and help develop overall definition in your legs and back. I don't think there's enough chest work to really develop the chest in that routine, but it's not a bodybuilding routine, it's a strength routine.

Most importantly for training, keep a log. it will help you track progress, and identify problem spots more easily than just to the gym and just throwing on weights.

 

[A2Paredes]

I know about the age but thats why I don’t like telling my age because nobody likes to say anything.. Like I am just gathering information so far but thanks anyways.

 

[bashman]

I know about the age but thats why I don’t like telling my age because nobody likes to say anything.. Like I am just gathering information so far but thanks anyways.

Because its seriously a bad idea and unnecessary if you are under age. Ultimately you will do you want, I'll just end by saying its a really bad idea, PERIOD!

 

[A2Paredes]

Could you tell me what can happen?? Other than its a bad idea?

 

[mw1]

Here is something Learn posted at MFF:

21 and under DS/Prohormone use
I have been getting an increasing number of messages from individuals under eighteen asking me advice about prohormones. Although, I don't mind having these types of discussions with them, I feel as though I have typed the side effects up for them numerous times and still have trouble detering them from using them, so I want to outline some of the potential risks involved with teenagers using prohormones.

Health Risks

When you are under 21, your endocrine system is still developing. This should be obvious as you are still going through the end of puberty, getting acne, etc. During this time peroid, supplementing with extrogenous hormones is EXTREMELY DANGEROUS. There is potential for very serious and long term side effects to occur. I hear all the time some of these people saying that "I've stopped growing, so it's okay". No - it's not okay. There are many other potential side effects besides growth plates. Here is a list of a few.

1) Premature closing of growth plates. This one is the most known about. Even if you think you have stopped growing, there still is a potential for height increase over time. I have known people who are 18+ who have continued to grow in height. Scientists know that growth plates don't fuse completely in some cases until individuals are past 22. Don't be deterred just because you haven't grown taller in awhile.

2) Impotence. Supplementing with hormones while you are still growing can potentially cause PERMANENT impotence and fertility issues in teenagers. When you add testosterone, estrogen and a wealth of other synthetic androgens to your body it can cause problems with your normal testicular growth and function. Remember, some of these effects are more than just temporary.

3) Liver/Kidney Problems. I hear all the time teenagers say "Well my friends used it and they got big and nothing happened to them." Really? How do you know? Have they been to a doctor and had their liver and kidney values checked? I doubt it. Just because a person looks okay on the outside, doesn't mean that they could have a host of problems on the inside. Liver and kidney damage is nothing short of serious. This can occur even in people who are past their teen years.

4) Gyno or "bitch tits". I believe this using androgens in teens can really increase the risk of gyno. Gyno has been known to happen naturally in many teenagers because of already fluxating hormones. When you add more hormones to the mix, you dramatically increase the problems. Remember that once you have gyno, its very hard to get rid of unless you take the proper precautions up front.

5) Hair loss/acne/prostate aggrevation, etc. All of these can be increased and agrevated with external androgen use. Have you ever seen a 20 year old going bald? It's not pretty. Don't think it can't happen to you.

6) Brain function. It is well known that hormones play a role in development of cognative brain function. Adding external hormones when your brain is still developing could be a disaster waiting to happen. How can you now many years down the road there won't be problems?

Psychological Problems

Being a teenager can be difficult as it is. Getting used to your own body image can be hard if you feel you're different than everyone else. Many teenagers turn to bodybuilding to help improve that image, and that can be a very healthy thing. However, when a teenager becomes obsessed or is only after short term goals of getting ripped in 6 weeks then it can be a very serious problem when prohormones/steroids get in the mix.

1) Abuse. There is a high potential for abuse when individuals turn to prohormones/steroids when they aren't mature enough to handle them. Most of these individuals had these substances recommended to them by friends with erroneous data presented to them on how to use them and how they work. I have seen teenagers on this board claim to never come off cycles of Mag-10 and 1AD. There is no reason to abuse your body like that. Never coming off hormones can have even greater risks than using them for the short term, such as halting normal hormone production permantely. If you have a problem and want to discuss it with us, please post it.

Legal Problems

Using steroids and prohormones underage can have very obvious legal implications. Since all prohormones have labels on them indicated that they are not for use for individuals under 18, you take into liability not only yourself and your family, but risk liability on the manufacturer and seller who sold these substances to you. By doing this, you are hurting the community who use these substances responsibly. Take responsibility for yourself and stay away from these. Causing harm to yourself is one thing, but everytime a teenager uses prohormones, the potential for them being banned increases. Here are some other problems

1) Drug testing. If you are a teenager playing sports, using steroids and prohormones can seem like a good idea to increase your performance. How would it look if you suddenly got tested for them? Being tested for prohormones WILL SHOW UP AS STEROIDS. You will have no recourse for this, and could potentially find yourself being investigated by the authorities.

2) Purchasing steroids is already illegal, but purchasing prohormones can have implications as well. As I already said, on all bottles of prohormones there is a label saying "Not for use for individuals under 18". That is not just printed on there as a joke, that is on there for a reason. If you bought these substances underage and then got into trouble or had one of the side effects listed above from taking these, what do you think your parents are going to do? They are probably going to sue the manufacturer, sue the seller, and possibly contact their congressmen demanding these substances be banned. You just screwed everyone because you were in a hurry to get some quick muscle. Take into consideration the rest of us before you make your irresponsible purchases.

Please read this over and think about what your goals are a long time before you decide to take your health into jeopardy and risk legal repercussions by using prohormones and steroids as a teenager. You not only endanger yourself, but all of us who want to or may want to use prohormones one day. We all want to have good gains and have pefect bodies, thats why we're here. But rushing into things and abusing susbstances is not the answer. There is absolutely no justification for teenagers to use prohormones or steroids. None. So, before you decide to use them - please take some time out, and make a post describing your training, diet and supplemenation. I know that me and the other members of the board would be more than happy to help you make some changes to your diet and training to help gain naturally, without the use of androgens. Doing this, you will save us all a a lot of grief.

** found on another board ** Reply Reply With Quote Blog this Post
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:umbrella::umbrella:

 

[learn]

Here is something Learn posted at MFF:

21 and under DS/Prohormone use
I have been getting an increasing number of messages from individuals under eighteen asking me advice about prohormones. Although, I don't mind having these types of discussions with them, I feel as though I have typed the side effects up for them numerous times and still have trouble detering them from using them, so I want to outline some of the potential risks involved with teenagers using prohormones.

Health Risks

When you are under 21, your endocrine system is still developing. This should be obvious as you are still going through the end of puberty, getting acne, etc. During this time peroid, supplementing with extrogenous hormones is EXTREMELY DANGEROUS. There is potential for very serious and long term side effects to occur. I hear all the time some of these people saying that "I've stopped growing, so it's okay". No - it's not okay. There are many other potential side effects besides growth plates. Here is a list of a few.

1) Premature closing of growth plates. This one is the most known about. Even if you think you have stopped growing, there still is a potential for height increase over time. I have known people who are 18+ who have continued to grow in height. Scientists know that growth plates don't fuse completely in some cases until individuals are past 22. Don't be deterred just because you haven't grown taller in awhile.

2) Impotence. Supplementing with hormones while you are still growing can potentially cause PERMANENT impotence and fertility issues in teenagers. When you add testosterone, estrogen and a wealth of other synthetic androgens to your body it can cause problems with your normal testicular growth and function. Remember, some of these effects are more than just temporary.

3) Liver/Kidney Problems. I hear all the time teenagers say "Well my friends used it and they got big and nothing happened to them." Really? How do you know? Have they been to a doctor and had their liver and kidney values checked? I doubt it. Just because a person looks okay on the outside, doesn't mean that they could have a host of problems on the inside. Liver and kidney damage is nothing short of serious. This can occur even in people who are past their teen years.

4) Gyno or "bitch tits". I believe this using androgens in teens can really increase the risk of gyno. Gyno has been known to happen naturally in many teenagers because of already fluxating hormones. When you add more hormones to the mix, you dramatically increase the problems. Remember that once you have gyno, its very hard to get rid of unless you take the proper precautions up front.

5) Hair loss/acne/prostate aggrevation, etc. All of these can be increased and agrevated with external androgen use. Have you ever seen a 20 year old going bald? It's not pretty. Don't think it can't happen to you.

6) Brain function. It is well known that hormones play a role in development of cognative brain function. Adding external hormones when your brain is still developing could be a disaster waiting to happen. How can you now many years down the road there won't be problems?

Psychological Problems

Being a teenager can be difficult as it is. Getting used to your own body image can be hard if you feel you're different than everyone else. Many teenagers turn to bodybuilding to help improve that image, and that can be a very healthy thing. However, when a teenager becomes obsessed or is only after short term goals of getting ripped in 6 weeks then it can be a very serious problem when prohormones/steroids get in the mix.

1) Abuse. There is a high potential for abuse when individuals turn to prohormones/steroids when they aren't mature enough to handle them. Most of these individuals had these substances recommended to them by friends with erroneous data presented to them on how to use them and how they work. I have seen teenagers on this board claim to never come off cycles of Mag-10 and 1AD. There is no reason to abuse your body like that. Never coming off hormones can have even greater risks than using them for the short term, such as halting normal hormone production permantely. If you have a problem and want to discuss it with us, please post it.

Legal Problems

Using steroids and prohormones underage can have very obvious legal implications. Since all prohormones have labels on them indicated that they are not for use for individuals under 18, you take into liability not only yourself and your family, but risk liability on the manufacturer and seller who sold these substances to you. By doing this, you are hurting the community who use these substances responsibly. Take responsibility for yourself and stay away from these. Causing harm to yourself is one thing, but everytime a teenager uses prohormones, the potential for them being banned increases. Here are some other problems

1) Drug testing. If you are a teenager playing sports, using steroids and prohormones can seem like a good idea to increase your performance. How would it look if you suddenly got tested for them? Being tested for prohormones WILL SHOW UP AS STEROIDS. You will have no recourse for this, and could potentially find yourself being investigated by the authorities.

2) Purchasing steroids is already illegal, but purchasing prohormones can have implications as well. As I already said, on all bottles of prohormones there is a label saying "Not for use for individuals under 18". That is not just printed on there as a joke, that is on there for a reason. If you bought these substances underage and then got into trouble or had one of the side effects listed above from taking these, what do you think your parents are going to do? They are probably going to sue the manufacturer, sue the seller, and possibly contact their congressmen demanding these substances be banned. You just screwed everyone because you were in a hurry to get some quick muscle. Take into consideration the rest of us before you make your irresponsible purchases.

Please read this over and think about what your goals are a long time before you decide to take your health into jeopardy and risk legal repercussions by using prohormones and steroids as a teenager. You not only endanger yourself, but all of us who want to or may want to use prohormones one day. We all want to have good gains and have pefect bodies, thats why we're here. But rushing into things and abusing susbstances is not the answer. There is absolutely no justification for teenagers to use prohormones or steroids. None. So, before you decide to use them - please take some time out, and make a post describing your training, diet and supplemenation. I know that me and the other members of the board would be more than happy to help you make some changes to your diet and training to help gain naturally, without the use of androgens. Doing this, you will save us all a a lot of grief.

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:umbrella::umbrella:

thanks for reposting tht arty:

 

[A2Paredes]

Here is something Learn posted at MFF:

21 and under DS/Prohormone use
I have been getting an increasing number of messages from individuals under eighteen asking me advice about prohormones. Although, I don't mind having these types of discussions with them, I feel as though I have typed the side effects up for them numerous times and still have trouble detering them from using them, so I want to outline some of the potential risks involved with teenagers using prohormones.

Health Risks

When you are under 21, your endocrine system is still developing. This should be obvious as you are still going through the end of puberty, getting acne, etc. During this time peroid, supplementing with extrogenous hormones is EXTREMELY DANGEROUS. There is potential for very serious and long term side effects to occur. I hear all the time some of these people saying that "I've stopped growing, so it's okay". No - it's not okay. There are many other potential side effects besides growth plates. Here is a list of a few.

1) Premature closing of growth plates. This one is the most known about. Even if you think you have stopped growing, there still is a potential for height increase over time. I have known people who are 18+ who have continued to grow in height. Scientists know that growth plates don't fuse completely in some cases until individuals are past 22. Don't be deterred just because you haven't grown taller in awhile.

2) Impotence. Supplementing with hormones while you are still growing can potentially cause PERMANENT impotence and fertility issues in teenagers. When you add testosterone, estrogen and a wealth of other synthetic androgens to your body it can cause problems with your normal testicular growth and function. Remember, some of these effects are more than just temporary.

3) Liver/Kidney Problems. I hear all the time teenagers say "Well my friends used it and they got big and nothing happened to them." Really? How do you know? Have they been to a doctor and had their liver and kidney values checked? I doubt it. Just because a person looks okay on the outside, doesn't mean that they could have a host of problems on the inside. Liver and kidney damage is nothing short of serious. This can occur even in people who are past their teen years.

4) Gyno or "bitch tits". I believe this using androgens in teens can really increase the risk of gyno. Gyno has been known to happen naturally in many teenagers because of already fluxating hormones. When you add more hormones to the mix, you dramatically increase the problems. Remember that once you have gyno, its very hard to get rid of unless you take the proper precautions up front.

5) Hair loss/acne/prostate aggrevation, etc. All of these can be increased and agrevated with external androgen use. Have you ever seen a 20 year old going bald? It's not pretty. Don't think it can't happen to you.

6) Brain function. It is well known that hormones play a role in development of cognative brain function. Adding external hormones when your brain is still developing could be a disaster waiting to happen. How can you now many years down the road there won't be problems?

Psychological Problems

Being a teenager can be difficult as it is. Getting used to your own body image can be hard if you feel you're different than everyone else. Many teenagers turn to bodybuilding to help improve that image, and that can be a very healthy thing. However, when a teenager becomes obsessed or is only after short term goals of getting ripped in 6 weeks then it can be a very serious problem when prohormones/steroids get in the mix.

1) Abuse. There is a high potential for abuse when individuals turn to prohormones/steroids when they aren't mature enough to handle them. Most of these individuals had these substances recommended to them by friends with erroneous data presented to them on how to use them and how they work. I have seen teenagers on this board claim to never come off cycles of Mag-10 and 1AD. There is no reason to abuse your body like that. Never coming off hormones can have even greater risks than using them for the short term, such as halting normal hormone production permantely. If you have a problem and want to discuss it with us, please post it.

Legal Problems

Using steroids and prohormones underage can have very obvious legal implications. Since all prohormones have labels on them indicated that they are not for use for individuals under 18, you take into liability not only yourself and your family, but risk liability on the manufacturer and seller who sold these substances to you. By doing this, you are hurting the community who use these substances responsibly. Take responsibility for yourself and stay away from these. Causing harm to yourself is one thing, but everytime a teenager uses prohormones, the potential for them being banned increases. Here are some other problems

1) Drug testing. If you are a teenager playing sports, using steroids and prohormones can seem like a good idea to increase your performance. How would it look if you suddenly got tested for them? Being tested for prohormones WILL SHOW UP AS STEROIDS. You will have no recourse for this, and could potentially find yourself being investigated by the authorities.

2) Purchasing steroids is already illegal, but purchasing prohormones can have implications as well. As I already said, on all bottles of prohormones there is a label saying "Not for use for individuals under 18". That is not just printed on there as a joke, that is on there for a reason. If you bought these substances underage and then got into trouble or had one of the side effects listed above from taking these, what do you think your parents are going to do? They are probably going to sue the manufacturer, sue the seller, and possibly contact their congressmen demanding these substances be banned. You just screwed everyone because you were in a hurry to get some quick muscle. Take into consideration the rest of us before you make your irresponsible purchases.

Please read this over and think about what your goals are a long time before you decide to take your health into jeopardy and risk legal repercussions by using prohormones and steroids as a teenager. You not only endanger yourself, but all of us who want to or may want to use prohormones one day. We all want to have good gains and have pefect bodies, thats why we're here. But rushing into things and abusing susbstances is not the answer. There is absolutely no justification for teenagers to use prohormones or steroids. None. So, before you decide to use them - please take some time out, and make a post describing your training, diet and supplemenation. I know that me and the other members of the board would be more than happy to help you make some changes to your diet and training to help gain naturally, without the use of androgens. Doing this, you will save us all a a lot of grief.

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:umbrella::umbrella:

Thank you for the post sir, I appreciate it. Now, I have these PHs.. umm can I just save them for a couple of years? I think P-stanz expires 2013 and h-drol im not sure because its blurry but its either 2011 or 2012. do you recommend saving them? where? Thanks for the help again.

 

[GQNemesis]

yupz you can store them .. just put em in your closest ...if you really want to get fancy and want to save em for 5-6yrs .. you can vaccum seal them (*looks at Xtren ..so sexy)

 

[A2Paredes]

yupz you can store them .. just put em in your closest ...if you really want to get fancy and want to save em for 5-6yrs .. you can vaccum seal them (*looks at Xtren ..so sexy)

Well from what you guys told me I decided to sell them to this guy that has been wanting the PHs for a while... I bought H-drol and Pstanz for like 120 both together but i sold them for 100 so I guess no more phs for me ever.. but unfortunately I bought cycle assist to do it and I dont think he wants to buy that so.. is there any use I can do of that for muscle? I am going to be taking protein, creatine, shotgun for pre workout and multavitamin and omega fish oil. Would cycle assist help for anything??

 

[gaijininjapan]

You can educate the person you will sell or sold them to, and sell him the Cycle Assist as well. Why did you decide to completely give up on PHs? Just curious...

As for the person you're selling it to. I hope he's not also 18, and that he knows what he's doing. If he knows what he's doing, he either already has support supps, or ???? I mean, why doesn't he want to buy your cycle assist off you too?

 

[A2Paredes]

You can educate the person you will sell or sold them to, and sell him the Cycle Assist as well. Why did you decide to completely give up on PHs? Just curious...

As for the person you're selling it to. I hope he's not also 18, and that he knows what he's doing. If he knows what he's doing, he either already has support supps, or ???? I mean, why doesn't he want to buy your cycle assist off you too?

Well, I am 18 and I really wanted to try them for one cycle but I realized that I wanted to still grow and I don’t want to jeopardize that opportunity. My brother is like 6 feet tall but my parents are like 5’6 and I am 5’7 so hopefully I will grow taller. By the time I am old enough to try these, they will be expired. The guy I sold the Phs said he has cycle assist pills from previous cycle so now I am stuck with this bottle. =/ I believe he knows how to handle it and I think he is 21.

 

[gaijininjapan]

There's nothing wrong with expired chemicals in my book. just hold on to the cycle assist for later then?

 

[A2Paredes]

What do you mean, once they expire they wont work as well right? or then why would they put expiration date on them. and about the cycle assist, These phs are getting banned and I don’t want to be stuck with it. Thats why I would sell them or use them because I am going to start lifting again this week.

 

[gaijininjapan]

Cycle Assist is not a PH/DS of any kind. It's basically support supplements that you should be taking with any PH/DS you use. So you don't need to worry about that part.

As for expiration date, different compounds have different reactions to light/temperature/humidity, etc. However, most substances can be kept a rather long time if they are kept away from light, sealed, and kept in a cool place such as basement or fridge.

Almost anything can be kept fresh under the right conditions. For instance, Grapes from CA are sold in China... shipped via ocean freight in refrigerated containers. A ship takes 3 weeks to cross the Pacific. When was the last time you left some grapes on your table for 3 weeks?

 

[A2Paredes]

I know cycle assist is not a PH but there is no point in having it.. and are PHs getting banned, if not, why did CEL stopped making these? and any ideas about what to do with the cycle assist? and also I have omega fish oil which I bought for the PHs. thanks for helping!

 

[gaijininjapan]

The fish oil is good regardless of whether you'r eon a cycle or not.

PH's are not getting banned. Certain PH's get banned all the time, and new ones come out. Companies always release these PH's in cycles, as in they come out for a while, then stop, then repeat. It's most likely to keep it low key. So don't worry. Or you can always order something now and hold on to it for a while.

 

[GQNemesis]

Hey buddy u have 2 of the best things on hand for ure health .. Cycle assist(liver,prostate,skin,etc care) .. Fish oils u or any1 can and should be consuming .. Don't just hold them for your cycle .. There so cheap and very beneficial

As for ph's like the person above stated ph's will keep getting banned .. Cel I believe started working on other sups .. I can't say for them .. But there's so many sites out there that still carry there ph/ds ..

Cycle assist .. Save it it's not like it'll go bad .. Put it in ute cabinet

I actually haven't ran any cycle this passmonth .. Buy I run cycleassist or cycle support regardless once or twice a yr(no ph cycles) doesn't do any harm (well my wallet buy health is far more important)

 

[A2Paredes]

But these products wont help me muscle wise right? Like since I wont be taking PHs, I am trying to get bigger with protein, creatine and multi vitamin. Also, I take shotgun sometimes before working out. Any other products I should take? I also plan on buying some pills called fireball that increases metabolism. I wanna get muscle and get lean. Thanks for info guys.

 

[GQNemesis]

Lol no they will not yield muscle mass .. Which creatine are u using ? And how old are u ?

Check my log in the sig, I'm doing creatine mono and loving it

 

[A2Paredes]

Lol no they will not yield muscle mass .. Which creatine are u using ? And how old are u ?

Check my log in the sig, I'm doing creatine mono and loving it

I am using a monohydrate creatine, and I am 18 years old, turning 19 in march.

What I am taking right now is protein, mono creatine, BCCA, multi vitamin, and omega fish oil. I decided to put on weight for like 3 months or so and then start cutting and when I do, I ll buy diet pills that increase metabolism, i think they are called Fireball. This week is when I am starting to take all these supplements for real because like the past month i couldn’t really go to the gym as often because of college. I am going to try to stick with this. Also, could you tell me if this is good enough:

Morning - Protein shake with a banana and multi vitamin. Also I put the BCCA powder in the protein shake.

Afternoon- I eat chipotle, very high protein food and lots of meat. Its like rice, beans, meats, and with tomatoes cheese and corn, etc.

Night- Shotgun before workout, BCCA during workout. Protein shake right after workout with creatine. I do abs after I drink my protein which take like 30 mins. I go home and shower and blah blah, after 1 hour of my first protein shake at the gym, I take another one before I go to sleep with fish oil pill. I take 50g (2 scoops) of whey protein each time and with 2% milk.

Tell me if this is good enough. Thank you very much.

 

[GQNemesis]

I am using a monohydrate creatine, and I am 18 years old, turning 19 in march.

What I am taking right now is protein, mono creatine, BCCA, multi vitamin, and omega fish oil. I decided to put on weight for like 3 months or so and then start cutting and when I do, I ll buy diet pills that increase metabolism, i think they are called Fireball. This week is when I am starting to take all these supplements for real because like the past month i couldn’t really go to the gym as often because of college. I am going to try to stick with this. Also, could you tell me if this is good enough:

Morning - Protein shake with a banana and multi vitamin. Also I put the BCCA powder in the protein shake.

Afternoon- I eat chipotle, very high protein food and lots of meat. Its like rice, beans, meats, and with tomatoes cheese and corn, etc.

Night- Shotgun before workout, BCCA during workout. Protein shake right after workout with creatine. I do abs after I drink my protein which take like 30 mins. I go home and shower and blah blah, after 1 hour of my first protein shake at the gym, I take another one before I go to sleep with fish oil pill. I take 50g (2 scoops) of whey protein each time and with 2% milk.

Tell me if this is good enough. Thank you very much.

hey bud, okay my 2cents ..


you have all the right supplements .. your diet needs to be improved big time bro .. you have to .. i mean you HAVEEEEEEEEEEEE to eat a breakfast mean, shake isnt enough .. if you want to gain weight .. and your not consuming weight gainers .. you need atleast 5meals in you .. by looking at your diet you are getting good amount of protein(most of it you will just **** it out .. so you neeed more calories)

before bed - if protein doesnt bother and wake up during night, keep taking it.

how much creatine mono will you be dosing ?

 

[FCrane]

I am using a monohydrate creatine, and I am 18 years old, turning 19 in march.

What I am taking right now is protein, mono creatine, BCCA, multi vitamin, and omega fish oil. I decided to put on weight for like 3 months or so and then start cutting and when I do, I ll buy diet pills that increase metabolism, i think they are called Fireball. This week is when I am starting to take all these supplements for real because like the past month i couldn’t really go to the gym as often because of college. I am going to try to stick with this. Also, could you tell me if this is good enough:

Morning - Protein shake with a banana and multi vitamin. Also I put the BCCA powder in the protein shake.

Afternoon- I eat chipotle, very high protein food and lots of meat. Its like rice, beans, meats, and with tomatoes cheese and corn, etc.

Night- Shotgun before workout, BCCA during workout. Protein shake right after workout with creatine. I do abs after I drink my protein which take like 30 mins. I go home and shower and blah blah, after 1 hour of my first protein shake at the gym, I take another one before I go to sleep with fish oil pill. I take 50g (2 scoops) of whey protein each time and with 2% milk.

Tell me if this is good enough. Thank you very much.

Eat way more solid food meals man. If cash is a concern drop the BCAA's in favor of something you can eat on the go. I used to eat a lot of protein bars when I went to college. Also nuts, fruit and pre-made shakes are a smart idea.

Too much whey too IMO. Eat some chicken or steak before bed.

 

[A2Paredes]

hey bud, okay my 2cents ..


you have all the right supplements .. your diet needs to be improved big time bro .. you have to .. i mean you HAVEEEEEEEEEEEE to eat a breakfast mean, shake isnt enough .. if you want to gain weight .. and your not consuming weight gainers .. you need atleast 5meals in you .. by looking at your diet you are getting good amount of protein(most of it you will just **** it out .. so you neeed more calories)

before bed - if protein doesnt bother and wake up during night, keep taking it.

how much creatine mono will you be dosing ?

Well how do you eat when you’re not hungry though?? i mean i just eat one meal and im full.. Today I tried to eat more than i could and I puked it all out.. And yea protein fills me up a lot too.

I take 5g of creatine mono, is that good enough?? maybe more than 5g cuz i always put more than a teaspoon.

 

[A2Paredes]

Eat way more solid food meals man. If cash is a concern drop the BCAA's in favor of something you can eat on the go. I used to eat a lot of protein bars when I went to college. Also nuts, fruit and pre-made shakes are a smart idea.

Too much whey too IMO. Eat some chicken or steak before bed.

I feel like fruits would be good but nuts i don’t like, I need someone to tell me that right diet i believe, cuz my workout is fine, its my diet that needs to improve. I do eat lots of chicken and steak.

 

[GQNemesis]

Well how do you eat when you’re not hungry though?? i mean i just eat one meal and im full.. Today I tried to eat more than i could and I puked it all out.. And yea protein fills me up a lot too.

I take 5g of creatine mono, is that good enough?? maybe more than 5g cuz i always put more than a teaspoon.

Oh man when I'm bulking .. I eat like 5-6 good meals

I'm not actually sure why your getting full so fast .. How much do you weight again ?

5g is more then enough .. I did 10g first week and then 5g rest of the way

 

[A2Paredes]

Oh man when I'm bulking .. I eat like 5-6 good meals

I'm not actually sure why your getting full so fast .. How much do you weight again ?

5g is more then enough .. I did 10g first week and then 5g rest of the way

I used to weight 150 and like past month i put like 12 pounds.. cuz Ive been trying to bulk… some of it is muscle but I used to have a very nice four pack, now its kinda gone… so Im not liking the bulking so much. Thats why I wanted to try the phs in the first place, so I could put lean muscle and get cut.

 

[GQNemesis]

I c what your saying .. Even with ph's you would need to eat around 2,500-3,000 cals ..100-150g cabs and 170g+protein

 

[gaijininjapan]

I used to weight 150 and like past month i put like 12 pounds.. cuz Ive been trying to bulk… some of it is muscle but I used to have a very nice four pack, now its kinda gone… so Im not liking the bulking so much. Thats why I wanted to try the phs in the first place, so I could put lean muscle and get cut.

If you're putting on 12lbs naturally, then you're eating too much and putting on fat as well. The natural limit for LBM gain is about 1-1.5lbs per month. So that should translate to no more than 5lbs of overall weight gain, but probably less since you'll be losing fat mass as well. With an anabolic, you can gain much more LBM per month depending on the anabolic you use, so eating excessive calories will not yield a significant increase in fat.

But, while you're on a PH, not eating enough will be counterproductive, so you'll literally need to force feed yourself. Add in liquid meals, and good fats. That should help you reach your caloric requirements.

But remember, PH/DS's are not magic pills. They just raise the limits of what you can do naturally, so you can train harder, recover faster, and make more muscle. You will have to feed your body accordingly though.

 

[A2Paredes]

I think my problem is that I eat one big meal that fills me too much and then im not hungry the whole day.. I am going to try to fix my diet and do you recommend doing card while trying to bulk??

 

[gaijininjapan]

I think my problem is that I eat one big meal that fills me too much and then im not hungry the whole day.. I am going to try to fix my diet and do you recommend doing card while trying to bulk??

I would keep cardio at a bare minimum. perhaps 2-3 light 20min sessions at most IMO.

as for your diet...

try eating 5 big meals per day...

Even if you're not hungry, your stomach will be empty after approx 2hrs, and you will have space to eat some more. As stated before, liquid meals are a great way to supplement calories. Try a gallon of whole milk per day, split throughout the day, if you're not lactose intolerant. That's an additional 700+ cal of good fats and protein. After a week or so, your body will get used to eating all that extra food, and you won't feel so lethargic/bloated from such high cal intake.

Of course, you need to plan your cal intake based on your goals. I'm no expert, but this is mostly just basic information. Of course there are other factors that may cause you to need to alter things though.

 

[A2Paredes]

Man since like last week i puked out the food… my stomach is weaker than ever.. i eat something and like 20 min later i just wanna puke it out. I think im going to lose some fat first because I don’t like having like extra 10 pounds of fat… Also, could you give me an example of foods i should eat other than chicken, steak, fish, etc. Like whats your diet?

 

[gaijininjapan]

My diet, being in Japan, will differ. I get 1/2 my protein from shakes made from whey and whole milk. real food include PB+J sandwiches, mixed nuts, fish, spaghetti w/ meat sauce, hard boiled eggs. I don't have the luxury to eat in the middle of work, and snak on foods all day. So I have to eat when I can, which is not the best for nutrient timing, but I make it work as best I can.

Don't try to increase your diet by 2000Cal in one day, do it gradually... You hould be able to increase by 200 cal per day w/o much issues. Just make sure you're working out HARD so that your body uses up the fuel and tells your brain that "it's okay, you're not overeating."

Another thing that helps if you're having problems downing enough calories, is have a caesin shake ready, drink 1L of water b4 bed, and when you wake up in the middle of th night to piss, drink the caesin shake.

Give us an example of what you've been eating and the times you ate what. Maybe there's a flaw somewhere that's causing you to overeat?

 

[A2Paredes]

My diet, being in Japan, will differ. I get 1/2 my protein from shakes made from whey and whole milk. real food include PB+J sandwiches, mixed nuts, fish, spaghetti w/ meat sauce, hard boiled eggs. I don't have the luxury to eat in the middle of work, and snak on foods all day. So I have to eat when I can, which is not the best for nutrient timing, but I make it work as best I can.

Don't try to increase your diet by 2000Cal in one day, do it gradually... You hould be able to increase by 200 cal per day w/o much issues. Just make sure you're working out HARD so that your body uses up the fuel and tells your brain that "it's okay, you're not overeating."

Another thing that helps if you're having problems downing enough calories, is have a caesin shake ready, drink 1L of water b4 bed, and when you wake up in the middle of th night to piss, drink the caesin shake.



Give us an example of what you've been eating and the times you ate what. Maybe there's a flaw somewhere that's causing you to overeat?

Okay well what I am plannning is to lose weight right now and keep some muscle because I definitely gained muscle, I see my arms bigger and I can bench more. I plan on going to the gym everyday, hopefully, lift weights and do cardio for like 20 min. Get into the sauna after cardio and be done for the day. Of course ill be doing abs too. My diet is going to be a low cal high protein. Morning, I ll probably go with a shake and some toast. I have classes in the morning so I cant do much… Afternoon, I usually tell my mom to cook chicken soup with like lots of vegetables and chicken and some potatoes. By afternoon i mean like 3 or 4 maybe. I mean sometimes I might not eat that everyday cuz I have classes like all day so I might just eat something to go. At night, I am going to try to eat some fruit but then again I hate to feel full when I go to the gym since I go to the gym at night. Thats what my diet is going to look like. I am going to try to lose some pounds but I completely lost my abs now…

Oh some questions

What kind of milk do you drink? cuz a gal of 2% is like 2k calories
how much protein is in each of your shakes? mine is like 50 plus like the milk so maybe around 60g each shake?
Also, I think another problem I am going to have is that not always i’ll be able to workout cuz im in college and I commute to it. Its like 45 min drive so its kinda tiring.


Thank you soooooo much for this help, it helps me a lot cuz nobody really likes to teach an 18 year old at the gym or anywhere.. i appreciate it.

 

[gaijininjapan]

Okay well what I am plannning is to lose weight right now and keep some muscle because I definitely gained muscle, I see my arms bigger and I can bench more. I plan on going to the gym everyday, hopefully, lift weights and do cardio for like 20 min. Get into the sauna after cardio and be done for the day. Of course ill be doing abs too. My diet is going to be a low cal high protein. Morning, I ll probably go with a shake and some toast. I have classes in the morning so I cant do much… Afternoon, I usually tell my mom to cook chicken soup with like lots of vegetables and chicken and some potatoes. By afternoon i mean like 3 or 4 maybe. I mean sometimes I might not eat that everyday cuz I have classes like all day so I might just eat something to go. At night, I am going to try to eat some fruit but then again I hate to feel full when I go to the gym since I go to the gym at night. Thats what my diet is going to look like. I am going to try to lose some pounds but I completely lost my abs now…

Oh some questions

What kind of milk do you drink? cuz a gal of 2% is like 2k calories
how much protein is in each of your shakes? mine is like 50 plus like the milk so maybe around 60g each shake?
Also, I think another problem I am going to have is that not always i’ll be able to workout cuz im in college and I commute to it. Its like 45 min drive so its kinda tiring.


Thank you soooooo much for this help, it helps me a lot cuz nobody really likes to teach an 18 year old at the gym or anywhere.. i appreciate it.

3-4 training days per week is fine. depending on your goals, since you can always run around the block at home or do bodyweight HIIT style routines at home for fatloss. a bulking diet and cutting diet will be different, but I suggest you ask in the nutrition forum for more info on that topic. For bulking, I use whole milk, and my body can only tolerate about 1L per day before I start squirting out the wrong end... so I keep it at that. During a bulk, my shakes are about 50g worth of whey + 12oz of milk.

Hope that helps.