Normally I wouldn't get so excited about a new Multi Vitamin but.

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by xhrr View Post
    Hilarious I forgot to laugh way to add something constructive. Back to blindly following for you.
    that was pretty rude
    nobody here is insulting you for sharing your opinion
    if you want to discuss things intelligently, great
    if not - please find another thread in which to spew your angst

    I didn't say what I thought would be better or should be changed cause the "troll" already did.
    the troll and all issues he raised, have been countered, more than once i think
    My beef is more so with the blends you include to cover things like liver and joint and cognition and how drastically underdosed they are. You won't be able to tell a difference in any of those categories because the doses are pixie dusted.
    yes we have covered this as well
    they are not meant to be full-blown specialty corrective doses of the items you mention, such as a stand-alone product would be
    so now, your issue is with the label?
    Would you buy a pre workout that has tons of blends yet not one is dosed accordingly? Who cares if it covers every category know to man if it won't have an appreciable effect in anything cause rather than being good at one thing it was bad at everything.
    and this is quite a stretch, not even an accurate comparison
    we have RDA levels (and beyond) of vitamins, minerals, and a bonus of some unique compounds we have included
    there are NO RDA-type levels for these things you mention, and no studies that i am aware of show of "minimum levels" of recommendation for some of these compounds needed in which to be operative let alone your opinion of "effective"
    if you have a valid scientific stance with which to show us that this is "pixie-dusting" and will provide no benefit, please share

    otherwise, i think you have voiced your OPINION, are simply here to denigrate the product and its design, it has been heard and i don't think you need bother with anything else, no?


  2. Wait. Are we arguing about a vitamin?
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by FL3X MAGNUM View Post
    Wait. Are we arguing about a vitamin?
    nope
    we (FINAFLEX) are attempting to educate
    not everybody is conducive to such platform

  4. It looks to me that everyone who said something positive about this multi (including myself) are the ones being educated.
    There are some pretty smart people making some valid points in here.
    The ingredient profile is not ideal on all fronts. That has been proven true here.
    But spending $60 on a multi is not ideal either. Especially for guys like me who couldn't care less about fancy ingredient profiles.
    I just take vitamins because they are a cheap staple.
    Use code "fl3x10" to get a free shirt with your purchase at Mind and Muscle

  5. Quote Originally Posted by FL3X MAGNUM View Post
    It looks to me that everyone who said something positive about this multi (including myself) are the ones being educated.
    There are some pretty smart people making some valid points in here.
    The ingredient profile is not ideal on all fronts. That has been proven true here.
    But spending $60 on a multi is not ideal either. Especially for guys like me who couldn't care less about fancy ingredient profiles.
    I just take vitamins because they are a cheap staple.
    okay fair enough

    i felt we have covered the continuous issues that have been brought about
    the issues continue to be repeated not in a conversational aspect, but as if there is negativity to be inferred and intended (since, once again, these issues have been covered), and the negative interraction with others is obvious

    a larger issue, is to have a rep from another company coming in to detract and criticize the product in our promotional thread, which as you should very well know is pointed prohibited behavior on this forum

    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    No chelate no care
    i am all for constructive criticism and conversation - i have said that before, and it is genuine
    love to discuss things, in the appropriate manner..
    the company wants valid feedback..what upstanding company would not want feedback on their product?
    it allows us to hear you guys, and make changes to product if we can and find it to be both suitable and practical

    what has transpired here, has not been with this positive intent in mind

    quite frankly, i find it to be sad
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  6. Snag I respect you and your opinion. I understand everything you are saying. There is no perfect Multi and making one would be expensive.

    Now for some constructive criticism from my view as a consumer who would be in the market for a new multi:

    I would rather see the blends dropped and the costs of those ingredients put towards better forms of vitamins and minerals (more broad, or ideally full spectrum E, Chelated minerals, methylcobalamin as b12, hopefully a proper vitamin A the form is not listed, etc.) I would even pay more to have that. A lot of that could probably be done for a similar price if you drop all of the blends.

    For just 10 dollars more, I could purchase MST MVP/ZMK combo and have one of the best mineral formulas and a very solid vitamin roster.

    Source Naturals is also a great multi for only 10 dollars more.

    However, these are higher priced and from my understanding you want to fill the niche of a lower cost but still quality multi vitamin correct?

    Quite simply, I could purchase OT with better forms of vitamins and minerals, full dosed blends, and I assume pay a similar amount given it has 15 more servings. I see OT as your biggest competitor. IMO this formula needs an overhaul if it is going to compete with OT. Honestly, given a similar price, there is no way I would purchase a multi with incomplete blends and inferior forms of vitamins and minerals over a product with better forms of vitamins and minerals and complete blends.

    This is not meant to "bash" your product or be disrespectful. Just my honest opinion and constructive criticism of what I feel would make this a better multi and help yall be more competitive in the market.

    Also, thats not to say this multi is all bad, I just think it needs some work

  7. Snag I respect you and your opinion. I understand everything you are saying. There is no perfect Multi and making one would be expensive.

    Now for some constructive criticism from my view as a consumer who would be in the market for a new multi:

    I would rather see the blends dropped and the costs of those ingredients put towards better forms of vitamins and minerals (more broad, or ideally full spectrum E, Chelated minerals, methylcobalamin as b12, hopefully a proper vitamin A the form is not listed, etc.) I would even pay more to have that. A lot of that could probably be done for a similar price if you drop all of the blends.

    For just 10 dollars more, I could purchase MST MVP/ZMK combo and have one of the best mineral formulas and a very solid vitamin roster.

    Source Naturals is also a great multi for only 10 dollars more.

    However, these are higher priced and from my understanding you want to fill the niche of a lower cost but still quality multi vitamin correct?

    Quite simply, I could purchase OT with better forms of vitamins and minerals, full dosed blends, and I assume pay a similar amount given it has 15 more servings. I see OT as your biggest competitor. IMO this formula needs an overhaul if it is going to compete with OT. Honestly, given a similar price, there is no way I would purchase a multi with incomplete blends and inferior forms of vitamins and minerals over a product with better forms of vitamins and minerals and complete blends.

    This is not meant to "bash" your product or be disrespectful. Just my honest opinion and constructive criticism of what I feel would make this a better multi and help yall be more competitive in the market.

    Also, thats not to say this multi is all bad, I just think it needs some work. I may have come across as harsh or rehashed things, but just trying to give my perspective as a consumer.

    Best of luck to yall I wish the best and I look forward to trying some of your products in the future

  8. CATdiesel76 - i indeed appreciate your feedback, and in fact i agree with much of what you say

    truth be told this very much sounds like a conversation i myself had with the owners
    there are reasons they have constructed it to the profile we have..

    that said, all valid points, all constructive, and absolutely no issue whatsoever taken with your presentation
    in fact, i am quite impressed by your depth of knowledge, and the way you communicate it

    thank you for your feedback, and i will surely pass it along


    pure and simple my friends - that is how it is done

  9. Quote Originally Posted by snagencyV2.0 View Post
    CATdiesel76 - i indeed appreciate your feedback, and in fact i agree with much of what you say

    truth be told this very much sounds like a conversation i myself had with the owners
    there are reasons they have constructed it to the profile we have..

    that said, all valid points, all constructive, and absolutely no issue whatsoever taken with your presentation
    in fact, i am quite impressed by your depth of knowledge, and the way you communicate it

    thank you for your feedback, and i will surely pass it along


    pure and simple my friends - that is how it is done
    Thanks brother I appreciate your openness you are a man of your word. Hope i helped. Much respect and good luck with everything

  10. Thank you Cat and Flex for reitterating my point.

    Snag I may have come off wrong, and for that I apologize.

  11. Quote Originally Posted by xhrr View Post
    Thank you Cat and Flex for reitterating my point.

    Snag I may have come off wrong, and for that I apologize.
    thank you for that
    perhaps i have come across wrong as well, and my apologies
    i never try to make anything personal on these forums, but today frustration level has been high lol..
    in any event, never meant to minimize your view as either a forum member or a consumer, that was never my intent

    peace

  12. Well Dang Snags, you have been in here all alone. I did not realize that everyone was still going on about this. CAT great suggestions much easier to deal with than someone coming in saying this sucks because...

    XHRR, you Sir are a big enough man to apologize for the implied negativity and that says good things about your character Sir.
    Live Hard, Laugh Hard, Love Hard and Heal Fast! - KLEEN
    Current Training Log -
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/276206-kleen-strong-body.html

  13. Quote Originally Posted by MrKleen73 View Post
    Well Dang Snags, you have been in here all alone. I did not realize that everyone was still going on about this. CAT great suggestions much easier to deal with than someone coming in saying this sucks because...

    XHRR, you Sir are a big enough man to apologize for the implied negativity and that says good things about your character Sir.
    Like I said I apologize I did come off a little hostile and it probably seemed like bashing which was not my intent. I have a bad habit of coming off the wrong way. Snag I took nothing personal you handled my criticism much better than I would have if the tables were turned. I have no ill will towards your company. I stand by my points I should have just approached it differently as CAT did. Best of luck to your company.

  14. again i appreciate the sentiment, xhrr

    for my part - no excuses, was simply a poor way in which to handle the situation
    how you come across, should not matter to the way i react to you, quite frankly
    my position as a rep, warrants better behavior than i have shown here in this thread, regardless of how one carries themselves
    (or for that matter, how i perceive one is carrying themselves, or perceive the interaction)
    we all get frustrated from time to time..unfortunately, i need to better check any frustration that i have

    i will rectify this going forward, rest assured

  15. Quote Originally Posted by snagencyV2.0 View Post
    okay fair enough

    i felt we have covered the continuous issues that have been brought about
    the issues continue to be repeated not in a conversational aspect, but as if there is negativity to be inferred and intended (since, once again, these issues have been covered), and the negative interraction with others is obvious

    a larger issue, is to have a rep from another company coming in to detract and criticize the product in our promotional thread, which as you should very well know is pointed prohibited behavior on this forum



    i am all for constructive criticism and conversation - i have said that before, and it is genuine
    love to discuss things, in the appropriate manner..
    the company wants valid feedback..what upstanding company would not want feedback on their product?
    it allows us to hear you guys, and make changes to product if we can and find it to be both suitable and practical

    what has transpired here, has not been with this positive intent in mind

    quite frankly, i find it to be sad
    dont be sad, get glad! 90% of my post are done via touch screen smart phone, and will be short answer! laugh my opinion doesn't matter, cause I'm not a consumer! but, I could be, you never know!

  16. In the end there was some good feedback here. Positive honest feedback helps us all to understand the issues better and exchange of ideas brings about change. Steve has already made some of the same suggestions being made by others to the owners like he has mentioned.
    Unremarkable is no way to go through life... Doug

  17. Okay Okay Group hug!
    Live Hard, Laugh Hard, Love Hard and Heal Fast! - KLEEN
    Current Training Log -
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/276206-kleen-strong-body.html

  18. i'm in it


  19. I'd hug too, but my arms are attached to my balls, so.....

  20. Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    I'd hug too, but my arms are attached to my balls, so.....
    I'm no homophobe. Bring it over here.

  21. Quote Originally Posted by xhrr

    I'm no homophobe. Bring it over here.
    Lmao

  22. ok, just read thru about the last 3 pages...one thing that struck me was snag saying atheletes are better nourished than gen pop and have less need for a multi!!!! what??????


    i have grave concerns for anyone who rely's solely on diet for their essential vitamins and minerals...gda seeds with insectisides/herbicides/weed killers built into the dna of seeds are healthy???? i bet the fruits/veggies we eat today contain only a small fraction of nutrients they once contained!!! you can say that i eat organic, all that means is natural fertiliser. the seeds are all becoming hybrid, if companies like monsanto have their way in the next 10 years all seed will be hybrid-why, because you can only use them once then you have to buy more!!!

    now we get to animal protein...OMG i don't even know where to start!!! how about hormones, ok-some of you will say hooray love me some hormones...but it is not muscle growing hormones that they want livestock to have-muscle is tough and sinewy...instead they want livestock to be high in estrogens, which cause them to have more fat and be more tender!!! then you don't have free range animals today, you have penned in animals which lay around and get fat faster which is desireable for breeders....geez, the list is very long...


    i hate to think anyone really believes they can get everything they need thru diet today, i guess it is possible, but it would require a lot of work and a ton of calories to meet those needs, imo.


    the FDA is fail in so many ways, i don't think i have enough time to list them all!!!!



    take your vitamin and mineral pills boys and girls!!!!
    GOD, FAMILY, COUNTRY!!!

  23. @ thebigt - ooooo the great monsanto consiracy

    i don't disagree with you here man..lots to this topic, and scary what that company has been getting away with for decades
    parent company of lysol..been lying for over 30yrs about their product containing phenols and dioxin (aka Agent Orange), adamantly denying..now they admit it, and the case has been in court for yrs (bigtime attorneys forestalling the inevitable payout, while everyone ignorant of this continue to buy lysol in stores)..

    the rats fed with monsanto grain, infested with nasty hyooge tumors all over thier bodies in no time..
    is S-C-A-R-Y!!!

    anyway man - pertaining to the stance everyone should take a multi: i don't disagree, but not everyone feels this way
    there are actually some very respected ppl in the medical field & scientific who stand in the opposite corner (ironically eh?)

    as for athletes: again, generalized statement. i don't say all or even majority of athletes understand nutrition better than average joe..
    but, i do surmise that more athletes eat better than the average joe, and specifically the pro athletes who have personal dieticians/coaches/cooks etc who structure dietary direction for them..

    anyway, these are but opinions, and interesting points for discussion
    all the other issues you bring up regarding foods/sourcing/impurities/hormones etc etc are very valid
    i cannot (and will not) sit here and say i have concrete validation that you MUST supplement your diet with a daily multi - but i can tell you my opinion is, yeah i think you should have your bases covered, sure

    a good multi is cheap enuff, that it makes sense not to take any chances

    good discussion man, i like it!

  24. Quote Originally Posted by snagencyV2.0 View Post
    @ thebigt - ooooo the great monsanto consiracy

    i don't disagree with you here man..lots to this topic, and scary what that company has been getting away with for decades
    parent company of lysol..been lying for over 30yrs about their product containing phenols and dioxin (aka Agent Orange), adamantly denying..now they admit it, and the case has been in court for yrs (bigtime attorneys forestalling the inevitable payout, while everyone ignorant of this continue to buy lysol in stores)..

    the rats fed with monsanto grain, infested with nasty hyooge tumors all over thier bodies in no time..
    is S-C-A-R-Y!!!

    anyway man - pertaining to the stance everyone should take a multi: i don't disagree, but not everyone feels this way
    there are actually some very respected ppl in the medical field & scientific who stand in the opposite corner (ironically eh?)

    as for athletes: again, generalized statement. i don't say all or even majority of athletes understand nutrition better than average joe..
    but, i do surmise that more athletes eat better than the average joe, and specifically the pro athletes who have personal dieticians/coaches/cooks etc who structure dietary direction for them..

    anyway, these are but opinions, and interesting points for discussion
    all the other issues you bring up regarding foods/sourcing/impurities/hormones etc etc are very valid
    i cannot (and will not) sit here and say i have concrete validation that you MUST supplement your diet with a daily multi - but i can tell you my opinion is, yeah i think you should have your bases covered, sure

    a good multi is cheap enuff, that it makes sense not to take any chances

    good discussion man, i like it!
    did you know that most countries in europe have a ban on importing corn from the u.s? europe has banned gdo, and over 90% of u.s corn is gdo.

    the human studies show ulcers, and the studies are less than 3 years old..the long term side effects from gdo products could be much worse than what even the adversaries of gdo fear!!! hell, they are even working on altering the genetics of fruits to make them stay fresh longer, even though many fear a carcinogen effect.

    the FDA is so pro business that if big business tells the feds it's safe then they are good to go. companies like adm and monsanto, along with big pharmaceutical have total control over the FDA.

    like you said, multi's are cheap enough that everyone should invest in them, in my honest opinion!!!
    GOD, FAMILY, COUNTRY!!!

  25. you ever check out the board of directors of monsanto? a regular who's who of big business

    Board of Directors

    David L. Chicoine
    David L. Chicoine, Ph.D. is president of South Dakota State University and professor of economics.

    Janice L. Fields
    Janice L. Fields is a former president of McDonald’s USA, LLC, a subsidiary of McDonald’s Corporation.

    Hugh Grant (no not that hugh grant)
    Hugh Grant is the chairman and chief executive officer of Monsanto Company.

    Arthur H. Harper
    Arthur H. Harper is managing partner of GenNx360 Capital Partners.

    Laura K. Ipsen
    Laura Ipsen is corporate vice president of Microsoft Corp.'s Worldwide Public Sector organization.

    Gwendolyn S. King
    Gwendolyn S. King is president of Podium Prose, a speakers bureau.

    C. Steven McMillan
    C. Steven McMillan is a retired chairman of the board and CEO of Sara Lee Corporation.

    Jon R. Moeller
    Jon R. Moeller is chief financial officer of The Procter & Gamble Company.

    William U. Parfet
    William U. Parfet is chairman of the board, chief executive officer and President of MPI Research Inc.

    George H. Poste, Ph. D., D.V.M.
    George H. Poste, Ph. D., D.V.M. is chief executive of Health Technology Networks.

    Robert J. Stevens
    Robert J. Stevens is chairman of the board and chief executive officer of Lockheed Martin Corporation.

    there is government tie-in as well, hillary clinton had some involvement, and i think elder george bush was involved at some point too, not sure, no time to check right now

    you think these guys are running scared of the FDA? or do you think it's the other way around..
    yeah buddy, conspiracy indeed

    part of the problem is - there's just too many damn ppl running around!
    that's the 'justification' at the end of the day here, to produce enuff food to feed the masses
    (with the byproduct of a few select ppl getting very rich off the implementation of such)
    unfortunately, just like we have ignored the environmental issues and all we have done to destroy it (in order to survive & thrive), so too have we ignored the fact we are destroying the very thing that we claim to worry about keeping us alive - ie food!

    is a mess indeed, my friend.
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