Instead of clen

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    Instead of clen


    Clen is such a harsh compound. Depending on your level in bodybuilding, clen almost feels as though as a staple in contest prep.

    Is there a supplement or stack that could be just as equal or could help so you dont have to take much clen?

    Also what would be the layout and dosages of this?

    Thank you sir!

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    Albuterol and eca are two good options. But I assume you know of those.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PumpHouse View Post
    Albuterol and eca are two good options. But I assume you know of those.
    I am. Ephedrine is a nice herb but is getting harder and harder to come by.... my bronkaid isnt around any more....
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    Primatine works just as well when bronkaid isn't available.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PumpHouse View Post
    Primatine works just as well when bronkaid isn't available.
    Primatine? Over the counter? Pharmaceutical? Or supplement?
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    It's basically the same as bronkaid. Sold under the same circumstances.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PumpHouse View Post
    It's basically the same as bronkaid. Sold under the same circumstances.
    Ok. Thanks bud good to know.
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    No problem. But other than that I believe these new age peptides show some real promise, ghrp and cjc and what not. But nothing beats good ole fashion ec. I can't handle clen.
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    Quote Originally Posted by madds87 View Post

    Primatine? Over the counter? Pharmaceutical? Or supplement?
    It's a HCL instead of Sulfate

    Same thing basically
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    True it is. I believe 12.5 Mgs primatine is equivalent to 25 Mgs bronkaid.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PumpHouse View Post
    True it is. I believe 12.5 Mgs primatine is equivalent to 25 Mgs bronkaid.
    Not exactly.
    HCL is going to be stronger than sulfate but not by that much.
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    Ephedrine HCl is approximately 82% ephedrine by weight.
    Ephedrine sulfate is approximately 77% ephedrine by weight.

    25 mg ephedrine HCl = 20.5 mg ephedrine
    25 mg ephedrine sulfate = 19.25 mg ephedrine

    Found this on a different forum. ^
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephenGarcia View Post

    It's a HCL instead of Sulfate

    Same thing basically
    Oh so requires less?
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephenGarcia View Post
    Ephedrine HCl is approximately 82% ephedrine by weight.
    Ephedrine sulfate is approximately 77% ephedrine by weight.

    25 mg ephedrine HCl = 20.5 mg ephedrine
    25 mg ephedrine sulfate = 19.25 mg ephedrine

    Found this on a different forum. ^
    Oooo ok so more.... cool....

    Curious about docs response too.
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    Quote Originally Posted by madds87 View Post
    Clen is such a harsh compound. Depending on your level in bodybuilding, clen almost feels as though as a staple in contest prep.

    Is there a supplement or stack that could be just as equal or could help so you dont have to take much clen?

    Also what would be the layout and dosages of this?

    Thank you sir!
    there are no supplement alternatives

    other drugs that do the same thing include albuterol, formeterol, fenoterol, ractopamine etc

    clen IMO is overrated. However when i first tried it in 1991 it was amazing

    EC stack is just as good IMO or better
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    Quote Originally Posted by madds87 View Post
    I am. Ephedrine is a nice herb but is getting harder and harder to come by.... my bronkaid isnt around any more....
    primatene tablets. CVS carries it now
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    Quote Originally Posted by madds87 View Post
    Oh so requires less?

    look at the figures. the difference is insignificant
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    I hate clen. The amount of jitters and random sweats was terrible for absolutely zero results. Conversely, with DNP, no jitters, still sweats but plenty of weightloss. Or ECA is also leaps and bounds better with fat loss and no random jitters or sweats.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post

    primatene tablets. CVS carries it now
    Ok thank yall
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beejis60 View Post
    I hate clen. The amount of jitters and random sweats was terrible for absolutely zero results. Conversely, with DNP, no jitters, still sweats but plenty of weightloss. Or ECA is also leaps and bounds better with fat loss and no random jitters or sweats.
    I had the same issues with Clen. DNP.... I won't come within a mile of it, but to each his own. I love ECA and it has always been great to me. I've found recently that my Adderall prescription has allowed me to shed a decent amount of bodyfat when I really didn't have that much to begin with. I was able to preserve muscle, too, though my diet is sickeningly clean right now. I do realize that prescription amphetamines aren't really an option for most and probably shouldn't be.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    there are no supplement alternatives

    other drugs that do the same thing include albuterol, formeterol, fenoterol, ractopamine etc

    clen IMO is overrated. However when i first tried it in 1991 it was amazing

    EC stack is just as good IMO or better
    You change your opinion pretty fast. I remember you stated that clen was much better than EC on PHF. Lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by nidhogg View Post
    You change your opinion pretty fast. I remember you stated that clen was much better than EC on PHF. Lol
    that is not possibleperhaps i said it was a much better beta2-agonist, but thats not the same as saying its much better for fat loss
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    that is not possibleperhaps i said it was a much better beta2-agonist, but thats not the same as saying its much better for fat loss
    You said the same exact thing over there iirc. You also talked about how Clen could be anabolic somehow but only the first time you use it but after that you could take a year off and it won't have the same effect iirc
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    Quote Originally Posted by PumpHouse View Post
    No problem. But other than that I believe these new age peptides show some real promise, ghrp and cjc and what not. But nothing beats good ole fashion ec. I can't handle clen.
    GHRP+CJC-1295 w/o dac is a good combo but it really does not help all that much in your normal contest prep. That being said 6 months of that combo will help you shed some fat but you will hold about 9-12 lbs of water until about 2 weeks post per my rat testing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by harbonah View Post
    GHRP+CJC-1295 w/o dac is a good combo but it really does not help all that much in your normal contest prep. That being said 6 months of that combo will help you shed some fat but you will hold about 9-12 lbs of water until about 2 weeks post per my rat testing.
    the combo can make someone hungry which isnt good for dieting. and yeah with gh and gh release peptide products you can retain water
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    Quote Originally Posted by harbonah View Post
    GHRP+CJC-1295 w/o dac is a good combo but it really does not help all that much in your normal contest prep. That being said 6 months of that combo will help you shed some fat but you will hold about 9-12 lbs of water until about 2 weeks post per my rat testing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    the combo can make someone hungry which isnt good for dieting. and yeah with gh and gh release peptide products you can retain water
    I personally found the combo to have zero effect of bodyfat... however I did run it in PCT after a 6mo cycle with a plethora of other peptides and stuff and I only lost between 0-5% of my lift numbers.
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    I recently started doing this combo to try and help my sleep problems, so far it's just making me very very hungry lol. Nut it's only week 1.
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    Re: Instead of clen


    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    the combo can make someone hungry which isnt good for dieting. and yeah with gh and gh release peptide products you can retain water
    The hunger is a good point but it can be over come its all about determination. But for some it might be wise to avoid it on a cut. Honestly ECA is all one might need to push through the hunger.

    Now the real trick is getting your rat to eat all three tabs for the ECA stack....

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    cocoa beans supposedly have a substance or two that mimic clen
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    Want to know more about. I noticed I get pretty good results with only 40mcg of Clen+Caffein a day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bossman523 View Post
    cocoa beans supposedly have a substance or two that mimic clen

    that stuff is in there in small concentration in relation to the other powerful stims in cocoa
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    i tried to link the study, but i cannot link since i am so new
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    Quote Originally Posted by bossman523 View Post
    i tried to link the study, but i cannot link since i am so new
    Are you referring to clovamide and if so PA have you ever looked into bringing this to market? or played with it the 2.5 hour half life seems rather low but ephedrine is only 4 hours and it works wonders might just have to take it more often.
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    Quote Originally Posted by harbonah View Post
    Are you referring to clovamide and if so PA have you ever looked into bringing this to market? or played with it the 2.5 hour half life seems rather low but ephedrine is only 4 hours and it works wonders might just have to take it more often.

    where did u get 2.5 hour half life from? i would be shocked if it was that long. the phenolic groups should be conjugated pretty quickly

    something showing beta2 agonist activity in vitro is still a long way from working in vivo. and i am not sure people would feel it enough to even know its working if it did

    so that stuff is on my wait and see list
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    where did u get 2.5 hour half life from? i would be shocked if it was that long. the phenolic groups should be conjugated pretty quickly

    something showing beta2 agonist activity in vitro is still a long way from working in vivo. and i am not sure people would feel it enough to even know its working if it did

    so that stuff is on my wait and see list
    It was one of those chembook style sites could be total BS but if I find it again ill post it up.
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    Abstract

    N-caffeoyldopamine is a phytochemical found in various plants, including cocoa (Theobroma cacao L.). N-caffeoyldopamine and its natural analogs (N-cinnamoyldopamine, N-coumaroyldopamine, N-feruloyldopamine, and N-sinapoyldopamine) were synthesized and investigated to determine their potency as beta-adrenoceptor agonists, because they have chemical structural moieties found in beta-adrenoceptor agonists. Among the compounds tested in this study, N-coumaroyldopamine and N-caffeoyldopamine were the two most potent compounds, able to increase cAMP at the concentrations < 0.05 microM in U937 cells. The decreasing order of potency was N-coumaroyldopamine > N-caffeoyldopamine > N-feruloyldopamine > N-sinapoyldopamine > N-cinnamoyldopamine. Using beta2-specific antagonists (butoxamine and ICI 118551), N-coumaroyldopamine and N-caffeoyldopamine were found to increase cAMP via beta2-adrenoceptors in U937 cells. In producing cAMP in U937 cells, N-coumaroyldopamine and N-caffeoyldopamine were as potent as several well-known beta2-adrenoceptor agonists (salbutamol, procaterol, and fenoterol). These results indicate that N-coumaroyldopamine and N-caffeoyldopamine are potent compounds able to increase cAMP via beta2-adrenoceptors in U937 cells, and may have potential effects on human health.
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    that's from pubmed, but i think i saw something on ergo-log too
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    Quote Originally Posted by bossman523 View Post
    that's from pubmed, but i think i saw something on ergo-log too
    You can't just quote an abstract without giving a reference, daveman. Or at least give a PMID.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beejis60 View Post
    You can't just quote an abstract without giving a reference, daveman. Or at least give a PMID.
    links to what he is talking about. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15790999I think this is the ergo-log link?http://www.ergo-log.com/cacaoclenbuterol.html
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beejis60 View Post
    I hate clen. The amount of jitters and random sweats was terrible for absolutely zero results. Conversely, with DNP, no jitters, still sweats but plenty of weightloss. Or ECA is also leaps and bounds better with fat loss and no random jitters or sweats.
    DNP vs tren a for fat loss?
  

  
 

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