DEPRESSED: Just tore my left acl and meniscus .. now what?

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    DEPRESSED: Just tore my left acl and meniscus .. now what?


    Just had a bad knee injury playing basketball a couple of nights ago. I am currently waiting to schedule surgery. It has been a very rough past 6 months: Appendectomy last July, developed a bit of gyno toward the end of the year (was considering surgery for this) and now the knee blown out. I am getting super depressed - the gym was my stress relief. I have not had a knee injury before, but obviously I cannot lift heavy until my knee completely heals which may take 6 months or so. My question is what can I do in the gym or home to minimize muscle loss for the upper body. Am I pretty much limited to body weight exercises (pushups, pullups, etc.)?
    Currently 195, 6'2'', 10% bf, will be 38 in a month.
    Any advice / suggestions are appreciated.

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    After surgery I would think you could still do some upper body exercises as long as you keep from using the leg as support/stabilization . Off the top of my head you may have to resort to machines for most of it since you can do alot of upper body in a seated position. Not very exciting but it'll be maintenance untill you heal. Sorry to hear about your misfortune, good luck
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    Get 4-5 kits of GH have the surgery and be back to work full working order in two months....


    To minimize the loss take 150 to 200 milligrams of test a week that will help you keep your muscle you don't even have to work out it will help you keep what you have. Don't get me wrong when I say that you will not keep everything but it will help
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    tb-500
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    Quote Originally Posted by usealittle View Post
    Get 4-5 kits of GH have the surgery and be back to work full working order in two months....

    To minimize the loss take 150 to 200 milligrams of test a week that will help you keep your muscle you don't even have to work out it will help you keep what you have. Don't get me wrong when I say that you will not keep everything but it will help
    I'm not familiar at all with HGH. Does it help heal or correct old injuries? I wouldn't mind my shoulders, ankles and beat up joints getting an overhaul. Sorry to hijack
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    All I know is its really pricey? But I haven't looked into it at my young age lol
    Always willing to learn :D
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    Real HGH will fix pretty much any problem you have. Great for after surgery, could cut your rehab time in half or even better.... Yes it's not cheap but if you get good stuff, I say 100% worth it if you want to get back to your thing faster. By thing I mean gym, sport or whatever activity you do.
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    Quote Originally Posted by usealittle
    Get 4-5 kits of GH have the surgery and be back to work full working order in two months....
    Let's see, how can I say this nicely:

    No f'ing way will he be at 'full working order' in 2 months after ACL surgery, no matter how much hgh he takes.

    Show me some data...

    Sent from my iPhone using Am.com
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post

    Let's see, how can I say this nicely:

    No f'ing way will he be at 'full working order' in 2 months after ACL surgery, no matter how much hgh he takes.

    Show me some data...

    Sent from my iPhone using Am.com
    Ok, 2 months is way short but it will cut the rehab time in half or more... My bad on saying 2 months.
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    Quote Originally Posted by usealittle

    Ok, 2 months is way short but it will cut the rehab time in half or more... My bad on saying 2 months.
    Have you ever had acl surgery or taken hgh?

    Sent from my iPhone using Am.com
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    my gf tore her acl and flipped her meniscus about 2 years ago. take your post surgery rehab seriously or you will never get back to full order. the acl will make lateral movements hurt. the meniscus will make distance running hurt. squating might not be an option for a long time

    theyre gonna ask if you wanna use a cadavre acl or your own hamstring tendons for the acl replacement, id go with cadavre personally.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeg313 View Post
    After surgery I would think you could still do some upper body exercises as long as you keep from using the leg as support/stabilization . Off the top of my head you may have to resort to machines for most of it since you can do alot of upper body in a seated position. Not very exciting but it'll be maintenance untill you heal. Sorry to hear about your misfortune, good luck
    Thanks Mike. Guess I will do what I can and plan on killing it in rehab. I will update when surgery is scheduled and throughout post surgery.
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    Quote Originally Posted by usealittle View Post
    Get 4-5 kits of GH have the surgery and be back to work full working order in two months....

    To minimize the loss take 150 to 200 milligrams of test a week that will help you keep your muscle you don't even have to work out it will help you keep what you have. Don't get me wrong when I say that you will not keep everything but it will help
    I havent jumped into the pinning world yet, but sounds like may be good time to start with HGH and reading alot bout tb-500 healing powers
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    Quote Originally Posted by OnionKnight View Post
    my gf tore her acl and flipped her meniscus about 2 years ago. take your post surgery rehab seriously or you will never get back to full order. the acl will make lateral movements hurt. the meniscus will make distance running hurt. squating might not be an option for a long time

    theyre gonna ask if you wanna use a cadavre acl or your own hamstring tendons for the acl replacement, id go with cadavre personally.
    Thanks for the suggestions. I plan on working super hard in rehab. Think I will definitely go with donor tendon. My basketball resurgence was going so well...
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post

    Have you ever had acl surgery or taken hgh?

    Sent from my iPhone using Am.com
    No on the acl and yes on the GH... Took it after I had my knee worked on and 3 months after the surgery I was squating more then I ever had before... So yes it cut the recovery time way down and helped me get back to full power and above faster then without it.

    I'm sure that was your way of trying to put me on blast as to say I don't know what I'm talkin about but it has failed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by usealittle

    No on the acl and yes on the GH... Took it after I had my knee worked on and 3 months after the surgery I was squating more then I ever had before... So yes it cut the recovery time way down and helped me get back to full power and above faster then without it.

    I'm sure that was your way of trying to put me on blast as to say I don't know what I'm talkin about but it has failed.
    I find that very hard to believe, and what you're saying is not supported by studies done on GH and it's effects on recovery. The way you come off in this thread is "woo hoo, man take gh and it'll fix everything." That's broscience at it's finest. If GH is the wonder cure, how come my torn labrums haven't spontaneously fixed themselves? I've been on endo prescribed GH for over a year now and the greatest effect I've seen from It is on fat loss, not recovery.

    What was done to your knee and by what measures do you attribute your recovery to the GH? I too have had knee surgery and was squatting 3 months later: it's called not that bad of an injury. The bottom line is that we don't know yet what GH's effects are on recovery...

    Sent from my iPhone using Am.com
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    not to take sides here, but dont forget, the op isnt just "some knee work." a torn acl and torn miniscus = 2 surgeries months apart because theyre in the same leg. then months of rehab following.

    sry this happened to you op, youre out of squats for probly around a year depending on how long you wait for surgery
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    Some general supplements that may help you in post recovery:

    High concentrated fish oil (particularly EPA and liquid form) - 4-6 grams EPA/DHA
    Turmeric (curcumin 95%) - 2 grams daily
    Ginger (Standardized) - 2 grams daily
    glucosamine chondroitin msm (worth a try but mixed review) - Topical or pills
    Celadrin tablet/cream
    Cissus - various dosages have been posted by people
    Avocado Soybean Unsaponifiables - I haven't used this, but some positive reviews and studies on it (worth a look)

    Vitamin E oil for skin scars/healing

    A lot of these listed have anti-inflammatory benefits and may help with swelling and healing. Good luck!
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    I have had 6 ACL replacements (3 on each knee) and numerous menisectomies ... just had my left knee totally replaced ... been lifting for over 35 years ... just want to share what I know from personal experience ...

    The suggestion to choose cadaver tendon (vs patellar or hamstring graft from you own leg) is dead on ... recovery is much faster ... if you take graft from your own leg, you are recovering from yet another injury ...

    You probably have learned what I'm about to share from your ortho surgeon (if he is any good) but for the record ...

    During ACL replacement, they essentially take tissue (the middle third of the patellar or hamstring tendons, either cadaver or your own) and install it in the previous ACL location, anchored by bio-absorbable screws into your tibia and femur. This tissue only provides a structural framework for your body to build scar tissue around to stabilize the knee. In some cases, the new graft does reestablish its own blood supply but not that often. The interesting thing is the patellar or hamstring tendon is structurally much stronger than your original ACL but lacks the integrity necessary to withstand the torsional forces it is designed to absorb. It takes a year for the connective tissues, scarring, and blood supply to get properly established where you can return to all previous activities. You you will be off of crutches in a day or two and can resume most non-ballistic activities in 6 weeks. The movements you must avoid with an ACL replacement are torsional or twisting movement. I blew my last ACL (which had already been replaced twice) reracking a loaded bar after deadlifts ... just twisted the upper body a little while holding the loaded bar and heard it pop. So you need to avoid those types of stresses, which surprisingly you experience every day ... think about how your left knee is torqued when you get in & out of the driver's seat in a car ... see what I'm talking about? Bottom line for your ACL, follow your physical therapist's recommendations, give yourself a break (no big deal if you take a little more time to recover versus reinjury - I have lots of experience with stupid over achieving during PT), know you will lose ~50% of your leg strength just from the surgery but it will quickly return within a few months. You should be able to begin squatting (not monster weights but full squats) in 6 months. Recognize that squatting puts significant stress on the ACL because your upper and lower legs want to go in different directions ... there are many other exercises you can do that won't put the shear force on the ACL that a squat will. Do all the "silly" exercises they give you to stabilize the knee ... the strength of the knee stabilizers is the key to successful recovery ... that is why Adrian Peterson recovered so well ... his leg & knee strength were enough to compensate for the lack of structural integrity in his ACL. But in all cases, I was squatting heavy again within 9 months - of course, always paying the utmost attention to form and gradually building up the leg.

    During a menisectomy, they are almost always removing or trimming the torn cartilege, very rarely do they repair by suturing two pieces together. In the long run, the torn cartileges were my undoing ... there was no more cartilege cushioning my left knee, hence knee replacment (at age 54) and now no pain whatsoever in the knee. Even doing both ACL & cartilege in same surgery, you will be off of crutches in a day or two. Full recovery time for the menisectomy is only 6 weeks ... just long enough for the cartilege to heal where it was removed. However, the "gotcha" for cartilege repairs is compression since you it serves as a cushion for the joint. So you really don't want to put any major compression on the joint for the full 6 weeks or you run the risk of irritating or retearing it where it was repaired. Once again, follow the PT advice, do your exercises, take it easy, and it will be in your rear view in no time.

    You should be able to do ALL of your upper body work except standing movements ... even with light weight, it would be too easy to reinjure the leg. So there is no reason you cannot maintain your upper body through recovery.

    One thing I found as a result of my surgeries (I have also had ankle, shoulder, & back surgery ... lots of extreme sports with accidents!) was my joints and strength actually improved after the surgeries. This was the result of learning new ways to strengthen and stabilize through my physical therapist. I set shoulder & leg PRs AFTER having surgery on those joints. So look at this as an opportunity to learn more, try new movements and regimens, and find ways to work around injury.

    With respect to HGH & T, I think they would help accelerate your recovery but in no way to the degree suggested by some in this thread. I don't think you are a professional athlete, just a guy like myself who wants to look & feel good as we invariably get older. It will not make a huge difference in the big picture if you take 3-6 more months to get back to baseline versus the risk of reinjury and the long-term implications on your body as you get older. I had little respect for all the damage I did while younger - I always thought they could cut, reattach, whatever, and I would work out to get back to 100% ... but in the last 10 years, all that earlier foolishness has come back to haunt me ... so be smart ... a few extra months is insignificant in the big picture ...

    That's my 3 cents ...

    Good luck!
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    Quote Originally Posted by sisi1887 View Post
    Some general supplements that may help you in post recovery:

    High concentrated fish oil (particularly EPA and liquid form) - 4-6 grams EPA/DHA
    Turmeric (curcumin 95%) - 2 grams daily
    Ginger (Standardized) - 2 grams daily
    glucosamine chondroitin msm (worth a try but mixed review) - Topical or pills
    Celadrin tablet/cream
    Cissus - various dosages have been posted by people
    Avocado Soybean Unsaponifiables - I haven't used this, but some positive reviews and studies on it (worth a look)

    Vitamin E oil for skin scars/healing

    A lot of these listed have anti-inflammatory benefits and may help with swelling and healing. Good luck!
    To add to this you may want to try:
    collagen protein for recovery/repair
    BCAA's to keep muscle strength and size
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtinsideout View Post
    To add to this you may want to try:
    collagen protein for recovery/repair
    BCAA's to keep muscle strength and size

    Collagen protein has really bad amino acid profile. It's essentially gelatin I think. It would be better to just stick with a good whey in my opinion, and buy some bulk Leucine and add a few grams to every shake.

    Side note, has anyone used serrapeptase? I've heard that it's good for anti-inflammation but never used it. Something else to look into...
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    Quote Originally Posted by sisi1887 View Post
    Collagen protein has really bad amino acid profile. It's essentially gelatin I think. It would be better to just stick with a good whey in my opinion, and buy some bulk Leucine and add a few grams to every shake.

    Side note, has anyone used serrapeptase? I've heard that it's good for anti-inflammation but never used it. Something else to look into...
    Agreed i wouldn't substitute the collagen protein for whey or anything but it seemed to help me in the past with minor joint pain that didn't come back. Could have just healed on it's own but might be worth a shot if you are in a hurry to get better.
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    Hi guys,

    I had ACL reconstruction and meniscus repair in '95 on my right knee and a clean up job with removal of two screws in 2005. I would take a good joint supplement like Osteosport and maybe some creatine to keep from suffering from atrophy. I had quite a bit of atrophy after surgery, wish I had done the creatine while recovering. My right leg ended up being stronger in some aspects after rehab and I was back playing competitive sports in just over a year. Surgeries are a lot better these days though. Good luck, stay positive and bust ass during rehab and you should be fine. Just my two cents and I hope this helps.
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post

    I find that very hard to believe, and what you're saying is not supported by studies done on GH and it's effects on recovery. The way you come off in this thread is "woo hoo, man take gh and it'll fix everything." That's broscience at it's finest. If GH is the wonder cure, how come my torn labrums haven't spontaneously fixed themselves? I've been on endo prescribed GH for over a year now and the greatest effect I've seen from It is on fat loss, not recovery.

    What was done to your knee and by what measures do you attribute your recovery to the GH? I too have had knee surgery and was squatting 3 months later: it's called not that bad of an injury. The bottom line is that we don't know yet what GH's effects are on recovery...

    Sent from my iPhone using Am.com
    Look man, all I know is what iv seen and done. 6iu Ed for 3+ months got my knee back to 100%... Now the dose you got from your doc is what? 1-2... A dose like that is for life extension. And I do agree the acl is much worse then my problem but in my case it worked for me.

    Lol, I'm not here trying to see this guy GH... Or get him to use anything he does not want to. Just sharing my story about my knee. You can call it "bro-science at its best" but it worked for me.
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    I had basically the same injury about a year and a half except I also partially tore my mcl too! I actually waited almost six months before going to the orthopedic and for financial reasons at the time opted out of surgery so keep us posted on how you do as things have changed and the surgery is a possibility now. The doctor told as soon as the mcl goes totally I will not have a choice any way. Good luck!
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    Quote Originally Posted by boomdaddy3 View Post
    I have had 6 ACL replacements (3 on each knee) and numerous menisectomies ... just had my left knee totally replaced ... been lifting for over 35 years ... just want to share what I know from personal experience ...

    The suggestion to choose cadaver tendon (vs patellar or hamstring graft from you own leg) is dead on ... recovery is much faster ... if you take graft from your own leg, you are recovering from yet another injury ...

    You probably have learned what I'm about to share from your ortho surgeon (if he is any good) but for the record ...

    During ACL replacement, they essentially take tissue (the middle third of the patellar or hamstring tendons, either cadaver or your own) and install it in the previous ACL location, anchored by bio-absorbable screws into your tibia and femur. This tissue only provides a structural framework for your body to build scar tissue around to stabilize the knee. In some cases, the new graft does reestablish its own blood supply but not that often. The interesting thing is the patellar or hamstring tendon is structurally much stronger than your original ACL but lacks the integrity necessary to withstand the torsional forces it is designed to absorb. It takes a year for the connective tissues, scarring, and blood supply to get properly established where you can return to all previous activities. You you will be off of crutches in a day or two and can resume most non-ballistic activities in 6 weeks. The movements you must avoid with an ACL replacement are torsional or twisting movement. I blew my last ACL (which had already been replaced twice) reracking a loaded bar after deadlifts ... just twisted the upper body a little while holding the loaded bar and heard it pop. So you need to avoid those types of stresses, which surprisingly you experience every day ... think about how your left knee is torqued when you get in & out of the driver's seat in a car ... see what I'm talking about? Bottom line for your ACL, follow your physical therapist's recommendations, give yourself a break (no big deal if you take a little more time to recover versus reinjury - I have lots of experience with stupid over achieving during PT), know you will lose ~50% of your leg strength just from the surgery but it will quickly return within a few months. You should be able to begin squatting (not monster weights but full squats) in 6 months. Recognize that squatting puts significant stress on the ACL because your upper and lower legs want to go in different directions ... there are many other exercises you can do that won't put the shear force on the ACL that a squat will. Do all the "silly" exercises they give you to stabilize the knee ... the strength of the knee stabilizers is the key to successful recovery ... that is why Adrian Peterson recovered so well ... his leg & knee strength were enough to compensate for the lack of structural integrity in his ACL. But in all cases, I was squatting heavy again within 9 months - of course, always paying the utmost attention to form and gradually building up the leg.

    During a menisectomy, they are almost always removing or trimming the torn cartilege, very rarely do they repair by suturing two pieces together. In the long run, the torn cartileges were my undoing ... there was no more cartilege cushioning my left knee, hence knee replacment (at age 54) and now no pain whatsoever in the knee. Even doing both ACL & cartilege in same surgery, you will be off of crutches in a day or two. Full recovery time for the menisectomy is only 6 weeks ... just long enough for the cartilege to heal where it was removed. However, the "gotcha" for cartilege repairs is compression since you it serves as a cushion for the joint. So you really don't want to put any major compression on the joint for the full 6 weeks or you run the risk of irritating or retearing it where it was repaired. Once again, follow the PT advice, do your exercises, take it easy, and it will be in your rear view in no time.

    You should be able to do ALL of your upper body work except standing movements ... even with light weight, it would be too easy to reinjure the leg. So there is no reason you cannot maintain your upper body through recovery.

    One thing I found as a result of my surgeries (I have also had ankle, shoulder, & back surgery ... lots of extreme sports with accidents!) was my joints and strength actually improved after the surgeries. This was the result of learning new ways to strengthen and stabilize through my physical therapist. I set shoulder & leg PRs AFTER having surgery on those joints. So look at this as an opportunity to learn more, try new movements and regimens, and find ways to work around injury.

    With respect to HGH & T, I think they would help accelerate your recovery but in no way to the degree suggested by some in this thread. I don't think you are a professional athlete, just a guy like myself who wants to look & feel good as we invariably get older. It will not make a huge difference in the big picture if you take 3-6 more months to get back to baseline versus the risk of reinjury and the long-term implications on your body as you get older. I had little respect for all the damage I did while younger - I always thought they could cut, reattach, whatever, and I would work out to get back to 100% ... but in the last 10 years, all that earlier foolishness has come back to haunt me ... so be smart ... a few extra months is insignificant in the big picture ...

    That's my 3 cents ...

    Good luck!
    Damn man - 6 acl replacements. Thats insane.
    Thanks, I appreciate all the info and shared experiences.
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    ^^^^ wow , it's inspiring to hear from guys that go thru all that and still lift. Right on man!
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    After surgery, you're on a serious time frame to get your knee extension and flexion back. Typically your doc is looking for full knee extension and 125-130 degrees of knee flexion by week 4. The advice about torqueing your knee is good advice, you will have to be more careful even when you are 2-3 months. One thing to keep in mind are the ACL re-rupture rates. 33 percent chance of rerupture after ACL repair, then it jumps up to over 66 percent, and so on. In the early phases the ligament needs time to fully heal adhere to the bone, and your knee stability will not be great for a while.

    We are all weightlifting gung ho type people who will push through the pain, but now is not the time for that. Please listen to your physical therapist, he is only trying to help you, and it may seem like the things he is having you do is easy: early weight bearing through the effected limb, early motion, passive range of motion, pain control, balance and proprioception, and swelling control. Each place has about the same protocols but imho and experience I would not expect to return to higher level activities for at least 3 months. Your entire healing time may be 6 months to a year. Your meniscal tear repair will depend on what type of tear you have in there.

    If you have any questions about your post operative rehab please msg me and I'll try to help you as much as I can.
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    Haveacupp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KimChee View Post
    After surgery, you're on a serious time frame to get your knee extension and flexion back. Typically your doc is looking for full knee extension and 125-130 degrees of knee flexion by week 4. The advice about torqueing your knee is good advice, you will have to be more careful even when you are 2-3 months. One thing to keep in mind are the ACL re-rupture rates. 33 percent chance of rerupture after ACL repair, then it jumps up to over 66 percent, and so on. In the early phases the ligament needs time to fully heal adhere to the bone, and your knee stability will not be great for a while.

    We are all weightlifting gung ho type people who will push through the pain, but now is not the time for that. Please listen to your physical therapist, he is only trying to help you, and it may seem like the things he is having you do is easy: early weight bearing through the effected limb, early motion, passive range of motion, pain control, balance and proprioception, and swelling control. Each place has about the same protocols but imho and experience I would not expect to return to higher level activities for at least 3 months. Your entire healing time may be 6 months to a year. Your meniscal tear repair will depend on what type of tear you have in there.

    If you have any questions about your post operative rehab please msg me and I'll try to help you as much as I can.
    Had the surgery last Thurs the 14th. Ended up using my hamstring tendons to reconstruct acl. PT has been rough this past week - pushing it hard and sore as hell. Range of motion is improving greatly every day. Started at only 40 and now up to almost 100 degrees. Today was the first day I was able to make full revolutions on the bike. I am making some progress, but it is still killing me to not be back in the gym going all out or on the bball court.
  30. New Member
    KimChee's Avatar
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    Good work so far, props on the full revolution on the bike that is a big deal for most people. Just take your time you'll be working out and playing BB before you know it, as for now just take care of that ACL until it heals, it's going to be vulnerable til about June 14th..
    PT, DPT, OCS Clinical Residency
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    Quote Originally Posted by KimChee View Post
    Good work so far, props on the full revolution on the bike that is a big deal for most people. Just take your time you'll be working out and playing BB before you know it, as for now just take care of that ACL until it heals, it's going to be vulnerable til about June 14th..
    Thanks - appreciate the encouragement.
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    I agree with everyone else on rehab. I had total knee reconstruction in 1988. Tore the acl, mcl, and icl in a football game. I was only fifteen years old. I didn't have a choice about material for surgery. They used silicone ligaments and screws to hold everything together. I had to stay in the hospital for six days hooked up to a huge machine that moved my leg for me. After release I was on crutches for 7 months. Zero weight bearing. They just removed all the cartilage from knee. I tore it up in rehab and got to play football my junior and senior years. About six years ago I tore my rotator bench pressing. Repaired and rehabbed like crazy. Four months after that tore left rotator. Surgery for that and retore it three weeks later in rehab. Fixed and rehabbed, now stronger than ever. Got bigger and stronger for years and then last October I hearniated L5 and S1 discs and tore the ligament that goes around L5. Most painful injury I had. I am almost back to 75%. Once again I give all the credit to the physical therapists. I didn't lose anything but strength this time. I think being older does slow recovery some but our body holds on to gains better.
  

  
 

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