A Recovering Ultra-runner

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    A Recovering Ultra-runner


    I figured Iíd start my own thread since Iíve been hanging out here for a while and should probably stop hijacking other peopleís threads with my random comments. Because Iím lazy Iíll start by quoting my first post here.
    Quote Originally Posted by myself
    I turn 51 this December and only really started lifting seriously last year in December after 15+ years of ultra-running which I was getting bored with. Iíve always considered myself a ďhardgainerĒ ectomorph (I now realize I was an under-eater and poor trainer) and weighed only 113 lbs. when I joined the Marine Corps in 1982. 11 months ago I weighed 145 lbs. at 5í6Ē and after 7 months doing an HST style (followed the principles but didnít like the vanilla routine) program Iíd gained 30 lbs. up to 175 lbs. I spent some time cutting down to 165 and am trying to ďslowĒ bulk now.

    Since after cutting I became sort of goalless I searched around and 5 weeks ago decided to try out a Westside Barbell routine and totally loving it (I like to plan, think and tweak). My lifts are 230 lbs. bench press @ 165, 350 lbs. squat @ 168 and 350 lbs. deadlift @ 168.

    For the first time in my life had to upgrade to large T-shirts since the mediums were making every day look like ďTight-T-shirt-Tuesday.Ē My 32Ē jeans still fit in the waist but are now starting to rub the hair off the front of my upper legs.

    No PH use and only limited supplement use so far but Iíve been doing a lot of reading here.

    Iím certainly not ďhugeĒ but at nearly 51 I think Iím doing pretty well. My goal is to eventually get to 185-190 @ 10% BF.
    Since that post about a year ago a few things happened.

    All my lifts stagnated, I felt tired all the time except right after I lifted and was more moody than a teenage girl. My doc tried to put me on Prozac thinking I was depressed but eventually at the recommendation of a coworker when to a mens vitality clinic. My free test level was down to 60, no particular reason why (they ran a bunch of tests), so I went on injections of Test Cyp. Next to getting enough air, water and food itís the best thing Iíve ever done.

    No more lethargy or mood swings and my lifts started going up again. Before I left for a deployment about 3 months ago I was adding 5 lbs. / 2 weeks to my max Deadlift and Squat (alternately max one out each week) and finally got back to and surpassed the Bench I had before a shoulder impingement earlier in the year. So now my Deadlift is 385, Squat 380 and Bench 240. Iíve also had to ditch the large T-shirts and switch to X-large.

    Hopefully Iíll have something worthwhile to contribute to the forum since Iíve already gotten a wealth of information from here (and the site) and keep digging up more.

    Cheers
    Dean

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    Nice work Dean and thank you for your service. I'm 40 and one factor that I have really had to learn to work with and around is over training. My CNS can't keep up like it could 20 years ago regardless of my test levels. I run HCG to keep my test levels up, but have learned to reduce the frequency of my workouts or at least throw in a light lift day. With the reduced frequency I still maintain size very well, perhaps better than before
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    You make a great point about overtraining. I had always thought about it as a factor in not making progress so instead it hit me in two other ways first tendonitis and second the shoulder impingement both I’m sure brought on by overuse due to frequency (though I was keeping the volume low). Luckily I got lots of great info especially here on how to rehab myself and was able to due so without losing much in the way of strength or size. I started out doing an HST style workout but switched over to the Westside template for Powerlifting and have been bitten by the bug. The nice thing about their template is it advocates doing light two of the four days a week.

    I’ve actually lifted seriously twice before in my life once in the Marine Corps and then later in College. However, even though I made gains from 113 lbs. up to about 145 lbs. I really had no idea what I was doing so I know I didn’t progress nearly as well as I could have. Fast forward to the internet age and I’ve found great information and was able to go from 145 lbs. up to 180 lbs. at the age of 50+ despite low Test which are the best gains I’ve made in my life. Since I was only on Test for a few weeks prior to deploying I’m primed to see what I can do with more natural ( even high for my age since the clinic I go to is shooting to get me in the 800-900 range for free Test). Once they find the right dose of Test for me (doing 160mg/ week right now because 140mg/week only got me up to the mid 500s) they will add in HCG on a cyclic basis.
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    Quote Originally Posted by grunt03 View Post
    You make a great point about overtraining. I had always thought about it as a factor in not making progress so instead it hit me in two other ways first tendonitis and second the shoulder impingement both I’m sure brought on by overuse due to frequency (though I was keeping the volume low). Luckily I got lots of great info especially here on how to rehab myself and was able to due so without losing much in the way of strength or size. I started out doing an HST style workout but switched over to the Westside template for Powerlifting and have been bitten by the bug. The nice thing about their template is it advocates doing light two of the four days a week.

    I’ve actually lifted seriously twice before in my life once in the Marine Corps and then later in College. However, even though I made gains from 113 lbs. up to about 145 lbs. I really had no idea what I was doing so I know I didn’t progress nearly as well as I could have. Fast forward to the internet age and I’ve found great information and was able to go from 145 lbs. up to 180 lbs. at the age of 50+ despite low Test which are the best gains I’ve made in my life. Since I was only on Test for a few weeks prior to deploying I’m primed to see what I can do with more natural ( even high for my age since the clinic I go to is shooting to get me in the 800-900 range for free Test). Once they find the right dose of Test for me (doing 160mg/ week right now because 140mg/week only got me up to the mid 500s) they will add in HCG on a cyclic basis.
    Grunt,

    I have not been posting much anywhere here the last two months. Decided to drop by and see how your progress has been since mid-October?
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    Sorry it took so long to respond but I haven’t been checking forums much lately due to traveling.

    I was doing really well when I first got back from overseas in early October but at some point in late November if fell off the wagon so to speak. Basically I just got lazy and goal-less not being able to decide if I should cut and loose some fat or just keep bulking. Then I went for a run to get ready for my annual fitness test and nearly had a heart attack. So I’ve cut back on the lifting a little mostly lower body so I could get some running in, but I’m still sort of half-assing everything.

    Before that all happened I finally got my Deadlift and Squat going up again reaching 390 lbs. on both and my bench, which I neglected while overseas, was back up to 235 lbs. 5 lbs. short of my PR. The nice thing is that my Squat and Deadlift while my body weight dropped a few pounds since I was dieting.

    My Endo upped my Test Cyp dose a little from 160mg/week to 170mg/week. He also increased the aromatase inhibitor some since my estrogen was up.

    Thanks for stopping by and looking forward to seeing you post more again.

    Cheers
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    Quote Originally Posted by grunt03 View Post
    Sorry it took so long to respond but I haven’t been checking forums much lately due to traveling.

    I was doing really well when I first got back from overseas in early October but at some point in late November if fell off the wagon so to speak. Basically I just got lazy and goal-less not being able to decide if I should cut and loose some fat or just keep bulking. Then I went for a run to get ready for my annual fitness test and nearly had a heart attack. So I’ve cut back on the lifting a little mostly lower body so I could get some running in, but I’m still sort of half-assing everything.

    Before that all happened I finally got my Deadlift and Squat going up again reaching 390 lbs. on both and my bench, which I neglected while overseas, was back up to 235 lbs. 5 lbs. short of my PR. The nice thing is that my Squat and Deadlift while my body weight dropped a few pounds since I was dieting.

    My Endo upped my Test Cyp dose a little from 160mg/week to 170mg/week. He also increased the aromatase inhibitor some since my estrogen was up.

    Thanks for stopping by and looking forward to seeing you post more again.

    Cheers
    Grunt, I just got the guide lines for my annual physical due in Aug. Last year they lowered the requirement on blood pressure from 130/90 to 120/80 and if you take blood pressure meds it's an automatic once a year vs 2 year physical card. I just got notice that this year if your BMI is over 32 or your neck is greater than 17.5, you have to have a sleep apena test. I would not have passed last year, my neck was 18. I think maybe I better consider a cut cycle instead of my long awaited plans. Body weight is good, but I have to watch that neck size...my BP is between 120 and 130 so I am required to take meds to keep it in line with there charts.

    Hows the increased Test Cyp working out for you ?
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    Semper!
    ADVANCED MUSCLE SCIENCE
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    Quote Originally Posted by CopyCat View Post
    Semper!
    Fidelis!

    Nice Avatar BTW and profs to your continued service.
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldguns View Post
    Grunt, I just got the guide lines for my annual physical due in Aug. Last year they lowered the requirement on blood pressure from 130/90 to 120/80 and if you take blood pressure meds it's an automatic once a year vs 2 year physical card. I just got notice that this year if your BMI is over 32 or your neck is greater than 17.5, you have to have a sleep apena test. I would not have passed last year, my neck was 18. I think maybe I better consider a cut cycle instead of my long awaited plans. Body weight is good, but I have to watch that neck size...my BP is between 120 and 130 so I am required to take meds to keep it in line with there charts.

    Hows the increased Test Cyp working out for you ?
    Hey OG, nice to hear from you. I had to go on BP meds because mine varies anywhere from 117/75 to 160/110. The higher BP is almost 100% work related stress but as the doctor put it, it’s killing me so I better do something about it.

    Even though my net is only about 15.5” (I’m a actually a pretty small guy, frame wise) I have a lot of trouble sleeping and have been told I should get tested. I keep vacillating between cutting and bulking but mostly I think I just need to get back into better cardio shape since I don’t think my BF is that high.

    The Test Cyp is awesome. It’s given me a new lease on life and I highly recommend that any guy who feels tired and run downs most of the time get tested. When the Endo told me my free test level was 60 he was shocked that I was maintaining a workout routine at all let alone one as aggressive as I was pursuing. I have a feeling that the dose will be going up again but his philosophy is to start low and work up slowly. However, any way you cut it I feel so much better it’s amazing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by grunt03 View Post
    Hey OG, nice to hear from you. I had to go on BP meds because mine varies anywhere from 117/75 to 160/110. The higher BP is almost 100% work related stress but as the doctor put it, it’s killing me so I better do something about it.

    Even though my net is only about 15.5” (I’m a actually a pretty small guy, frame wise) I have a lot of trouble sleeping and have been told I should get tested. I keep vacillating between cutting and bulking but mostly I think I just need to get back into better cardio shape since I don’t think my BF is that high.

    The Test Cyp is awesome. It’s given me a new lease on life and I highly recommend that any guy who feels tired and run downs most of the time get tested. When the Endo told me my free test level was 60 he was shocked that I was maintaining a workout routine at all let alone one as aggressive as I was pursuing. I have a feeling that the dose will be going up again but his philosophy is to start low and work up slowly. However, any way you cut it I feel so much better it’s amazing.
    I'm waiting to see if my urologist changes me from Test e to test c. He normal script is test c, however since I still had a current script from my old doctor just let it run it run out and he said he would let me know. I am getting excellient results with his doseage, so whatever he wants is good for me. I have to agree, it changes your total outlook on things.

    I have been trying to de-stress my life style and get a better grip on things, easier said than done.! I am constantly looking for ways to get a handle on it. It always helped me to hit the gym...lower BP and all, can't wait to get my life back. Sooner or later we will figure all of this out.
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldguns View Post
    I'm waiting to see if my urologist changes me from Test e to test c. He normal script is test c, however since I still had a current script from my old doctor just let it run it run out and he said he would let me know. I am getting excellient results with his doseage, so whatever he wants is good for me. I have to agree, it changes your total outlook on things.

    I have been trying to de-stress my life style and get a better grip on things, easier said than done.! I am constantly looking for ways to get a handle on it. It always helped me to hit the gym...lower BP and all, can't wait to get my life back. Sooner or later we will figure all of this out.
    Iíve found that getting back to some running (well itís more like jogging with several mild heart attacks along the way) is really helping out my stress level. Working out with weights helps me de-stress but it only lasts a few hours where doing some running will last me most if not all of the day. Iím also noticing my workouts arenít leaving me as beat up as there were. I really neglected cardio ever since I started bulking two years ago no doubt due to my old ďhardgainerĒ mentality kicking in. However, Iíve found that now I can do at least some running without compromising my workouts so this time Iím going to maintain it and find a happy balance.

    I havenít been watching my eating habits over the holiday and have lost a few pounds, hopefully itís mostly fat since I havenít tested my maxes for almost a month now. Funny how people have always told me that someday I would get fat because of the way I eat but the reality is if I donít force feed myself I canít even maintain my present body weight. And no I donít eat ďcleanĒ on my days off either. Itís usually things like pizza, chips and dip, fast food or just about anything thatís greasy and salty and I still lose weight if I donít have my shakes.
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    I'd recommend looking into some HIIT to keep up your strength and size while getting in an even better cardio workout.
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    Quote Originally Posted by grunt03 View Post
    I’ve found that getting back to some running (well it’s more like jogging with several mild heart attacks along the way) is really helping out my stress level. Working out with weights helps me de-stress but it only lasts a few hours where doing some running will last me most if not all of the day. I’m also noticing my workouts aren’t leaving me as beat up as there were. I really neglected cardio ever since I started bulking two years ago no doubt due to my old “hardgainer” mentality kicking in. However, I’ve found that now I can do at least some running without compromising my workouts so this time I’m going to maintain it and find a happy balance.

    I haven’t been watching my eating habits over the holiday and have lost a few pounds, hopefully it’s mostly fat since I haven’t tested my maxes for almost a month now. Funny how people have always told me that someday I would get fat because of the way I eat but the reality is if I don’t force feed myself I can’t even maintain my present body weight. And no I don’t eat “clean” on my days off either. It’s usually things like pizza, chips and dip, fast food or just about anything that’s greasy and salty and I still lose weight if I don’t have my shakes.

    Sounds like my routine and mentality. I've only recently begun to get more serious about cardio and once I was past the initial pain, I began to enjoy the de-stress part of it. Its nice just to zone out and focus solely on pace, stride etc. I mostly do a mild form of HIIT. I recommend trying Sketcher's GoRun shoes...it has made a world of difference for me and my flat feet.

    My diet is, um, pretty laid back.

    I run HCG 2-3 times per week, if I can remember but will likely go to TRT someday. Looking forward to nice, even levels of T.
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    I started out mainly doing HIIT since I was already doing Hill Sprints as part of my GPP for lifting so I just extended the distance and time and started doing 30/30 intervals up hill. I generally only do sprints uphill because when I broke my leg years ago is didn’t quite set correctly so that foot tends to supinate too much when I run on level ground. I’ve run over 40k miles at least in my life and my only two injures were turning that ankle while doing intervals. In the last couple weeks I’ve adding in 15-20 minute steady state a couple times a week since.

    I also bought a rowing machine since that doesn’t seem to hurt my legs or lower back like running and lifting at the same time do. I try not to overdo things with my back since I have a ruptured disk from a work accident but Deadlifting has completely cured me of the chronic pain I used to suffer from that so if I have to choose between running and Deadlifting I stick with lifting since I’d rather be pain free than all of the time than feel good from running some of the time.

    I’ll check out those shoes. I’m finding I need more cushion than before when I used to ultra-run. Then I wanted the lightest shoes possible which worked at a body weight of 145lbs but not so much at 180lbs.

    I highly recommend TRT if you have low Test and not just from a lifting standpoint. I think more employers and insurance companies are realizing it’s more cost effective than dealing with the symptoms of low test in other ways or just ignoring them. Not only do I feel better, I don’t miss work anymore and am more productive when I am there. What sucked is I spent two years feeling like crap because my (former) doctor misdiagnosed me as being depressed. I figured out from the internet I had might have low Test and when to a specialist who confirmed it was very low (free Test of 60).

    That same doctor who misdiagnosed me also wanted me to stop lifting and go back to running because he felt I had put on too much weight though my BF% was still between 10-15%. He felt running was healthier to which I responded “how was running 100+ miles a week healthy?” I have yet to find a new doctor I trust.
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    A couple of things:

    I'd go to a running store that specializes in setting people up correctly before buying anything from Skechers. No offense to them, but they are really a low end shoe. I don't like running at all, but I do do it to break up swimming and biking. Once I had a pair of shoes that were set up for me, it changed everything. I still think running is the most boring thing you can do, but I don't have an ounce of pain in my beat up knees and ankles.

    Also, I will add to your TRT comment by saying that I have not been sick once since starting TRT a couple of years ago. And this is being around my kids that always have a cold and the fact that stress caused me to be sick quite a bit in the past. Now, at most I may get a little sniffle or something and it goes away by the next day. Talk about an invincible feeling!
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    Yeah I always go to a place here in Phoenix called ďThe Runners Den.Ē Itís a store owned by runners and their staff know what they are doing but over the years Iíve come to know what shoes work for me. The thing I always hated when I ultra-ran (except wearing out a pair of whose every 3-4 weeks) was that the shoe makers change them almost every year just like car models change. So one shoe that would work great could become a POS for me the next year and Iíd have to start trying different brands again to find one that worked. However this time around it will be simpler since I wonít be running stupid amounts so getting a shoe that isnít just right wonít be as bad.

    Once I get my cardio back in shape (running is really the only thing that works for me there) I plan to cut back on the running and maintain my cardio with weight training, rowing machine and mountain biking with just enough running to validate itís working. I figure that will keep the wear-and-tear on my legs and lower back to a minimum and the rowing and biking should serve as a form of active recovery. Iíve already found that by warming up on the rowing machine it makes doing Max Effort Squat and Deadlift days a lot easier.

    Good point about not getting sick. I wasnít really getting sick myself, I think I caught everything when I was a kid but the TRT has worked wonders in lowering my stress level (something Iím very prone too). Things that used to really get me going before TRT just seem to slide right off now. I would add that for me the invincible also runs to confidence. Iíve always been very Alpha and even with low Test I still was just out of habit but it didnít feel comfortable, more like an act. Now I feel in charge again, not like Iím just going through the motions.
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    Oh my god, I feel dumb. Lol. I forgot this was your ultra runner thread and here I am telling you how to buy shoes.

    Sorry about that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by grunt03 View Post
    Yeah I always go to a place here in Phoenix called “The Runners Den.” It’s a store owned by runners and their staff know what they are doing but over the years I’ve come to know what shoes work for me. The thing I always hated when I ultra-ran (except wearing out a pair of whose every 3-4 weeks) was that the shoe makers change them almost every year just like car models change. So one shoe that would work great could become a POS for me the next year and I’d have to start trying different brands again to find one that worked. However this time around it will be simpler since I won’t be running stupid amounts so getting a shoe that isn’t just right won’t be as bad.

    Once I get my cardio back in shape (running is really the only thing that works for me there) I plan to cut back on the running and maintain my cardio with weight training, rowing machine and mountain biking with just enough running to validate it’s working. I figure that will keep the wear-and-tear on my legs and lower back to a minimum and the rowing and biking should serve as a form of active recovery. I’ve already found that by warming up on the rowing machine it makes doing Max Effort Squat and Deadlift days a lot easier.

    Good point about not getting sick. I wasn’t really getting sick myself, I think I caught everything when I was a kid but the TRT has worked wonders in lowering my stress level (something I’m very prone too). Things that used to really get me going before TRT just seem to slide right off now. I would add that for me the invincible also runs to confidence. I’ve always been very Alpha and even with low Test I still was just out of habit but it didn’t feel comfortable, more like an act. Now I feel in charge again, not like I’m just going through the motions.
    I know that since I started on TRT my stress level is a lot lower. I guess it's due to feeling in charge once again, things just don't bother me as much as they did before...driven to the point of dealing with it or simply walking away.
  

  
 

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